When will the Tigers make a Trade?

[itsallgood8989]

I think Adam dunn has a couple of relatives on this board.... NO to Dunn! He doesn't fit the team! No sarcasm either.

[InfanteIago]

Originally Posted by JonBenke

I understand that, but I hope they can look at him and get an idea of what they have right now, going forward, better than us here .. that's all.

When is the trade deadline?

July 31st if you don't want to try and sneak a guy through waivers.

[pyrotigers]

Originally Posted by itsallgood8989

I think Adam dunn has a couple of relatives on this board.... NO to Dunn! He doesn't fit the team! No sarcasm either.

Adam Dunn: .266 .402 .546 .948

Marcus Thames: .257 .328 .514 .842
Ryan Raburn: .287 .364 .519 .882

Even if you think Thames and Raburn will keep up that production (they won't) he'd still be a massive upgrade for the DH spot.

Never mind that if you got rid of Magglio and his OPS which is nearly 300 points lower than Dunn's you could DH Dunn and still have Thames and Raburn in the field.

Dunn gets brought up a lot because he has played for bad teams pretty much his entire career and has been talked about as a trade candidate at the deadline...pretty much his entire career. Their are plenty of other guys who could be an upgrade at DH as well.

[JonBenke]

Adam Dunn would be an awesome addition, LH power bat, great OPS, and a guy that can protect Miguel Cabrera, which I think we need.

But the downer .. and really, the only downer .. is that Dunn would only fit on our team as a DH, which if Guillen can come back, negates where we can put and use Guillen, because the field is nowhere for either Dunn nor Guillen. I like that Dunn hits for power from the left side, and walks.

I keep reading that we'll have to pay Ordonez, either way .. if we release or keep him, that if he gets his proper ABs or whatever, that his vesting years will kick, with us on the hook for all that money. Before we discuss anything, we need to figure out on what the truth is with all that.

[will the thrill]

Originally Posted by Nate7474

Id like to see them go after Juan Pierre now that Manny is back he may want a chance to play everyday and might be cheaper then some of the other options out there. Getting on base at a good rate this year (.380obp). Would allow us to move Grandy down to drive in runs as he is not setting the table well this year. Would also be able to end the Josh Anderson experiment. I believe that he may be able to be had for something like Raburn and a minor league pitcher like Satterwhite or a starter instead of a RP like Hamilton. Raburn would have a lot of value to an NL team as a bench player being able to play multiple positions.

never trade the only guy on the team that is hitting. Ryan has value to us, he's hitting .280 now and can play multiple positions. They are finally giving the guy regular time, they need to keep himf or that

[pyrotigers]

Juan Pierre career: .301 .348 .373 .721

Juan Pierre this June: .264 .319 .309 .628

Amount of money Juan Pierre is making: lots

He hasn't been a good hitter in a long time, and his great May led to a horrible June. no thanks.

[DaYooperASBDT]

Juan Pierre, past five seasons:

2009 .797 OPS, .386 OBP, .328 BA
2008 .655 OPS, .327 OBP, .283 BA
2007 .685 OPS, .331 OBP, .293 BA
2006 .717 OPS, .330 OBP, .293 BA
2005 .680 OPS, .326 OBP, .276 BA

So which season appears to be the outlier?
No, thank you. We have better in-house options already.

[Shelton]

Originally Posted by itsallgood8989

I think Adam dunn has a couple of relatives on this board.... NO to Dunn! He doesn't fit the team! No sarcasm either.

How does he not fit the team? Because he is extremely proficient at hitting? I guess that would be true.

[InfanteIago]

Originally Posted by Shelton

How does he not fit the team? Because he is extremely proficient at hitting? I guess that would be true.

I think it's because Dunn is LH, we need more right handed hitters.

[Eric Cioe]

Dunn fits the team so long as he's a DH.

[Robinson for MVP]

Nats saying they have no plans to trade Dunn.

[sportz4life]

Originally Posted by Robinson for MVP

Nats saying they have no plans to trade Dunn.

Nats a reliable source..sheesh..

[sportz4life]

Originally Posted by Shelton

How does he not fit the team? Because he is extremely proficient at hitting? I guess that would be true.

Because the guy playing RF now isn't a defensive statue .. the way he's is stinging the ball, he reminds me of Rosie O'Donell before she got off the juice..

Plus their current DH..is outstanding against RH pitching..the move makes absolutely zero sense.

[sportz4life]

Originally Posted by DaYooperASBDT

Juan Pierre, past five seasons:

2009 .797 OPS, .386 OBP, .328 BA
2008 .655 OPS, .327 OBP, .283 BA
2007 .685 OPS, .331 OBP, .293 BA
2006 .717 OPS, .330 OBP, .293 BA
2005 .680 OPS, .326 OBP, .276 BA

So which season appears to be the outlier?
No, thank you. We have better in-house options already.

LIke he is hitting with a swizzle stick.

[DaYooperASBDT]

Originally Posted by Robinson for MVP

Nats saying they have no plans to trade Dunn.

Best username in history. Welcome to the board!

[sagnam]

Originally Posted by DaYooperASBDT

Juan Pierre, past five seasons

I want to first say that I have no interest in this team acquiring Pierre in any manner.

Not that any of his stats are very good, but why would you even list his OPS? Slugging is not why anyone would acquire him. OBP and steals are the stats that matter for a guy like Pierre.

[DaYooperASBDT]

Just emphasizing the fact that he is a pure singles hitter, and that he doesn't get nearly enough walks to fully utilize his speed. Also wanted to show that his 2009 SLG is an abberation, but yeah I could have used SLG instead of OPS there.

[itsallgood8989]

Originally Posted by Shelton

How does he not fit the team? Because he is extremely proficient at hitting? I guess that would be true.

he doesn't fit because he is a liability in the field and you don't trade for a DH unless his name is George Herman Ruth.

[tiger337]

Originally Posted by itsallgood8989

you don't trade for a DH unless his name is George Herman Ruth.

Why? Ideally, you want somebody who can hit and field but your stance is pretty extreme. What about Edgar Martinez. Would you have traded for him in is prime?

[Corky]

Originally Posted by tiger337

Why? Ideally, you want somebody who can hit and field but your stance is pretty extreme. What about Edgar Martinez. Would you have traded for him in is prime?

It was a beautiful thing watching Edgar hit.

[The Truman Show]

Originally Posted by itsallgood8989

he doesn't fit because he is a liability in the field and you don't trade for a DH unless his name is George Herman Ruth.

How about the team just trade for good players? The phrase "beggars can't be choosers" comes to mind. Plus, I can think of a certain lefty DH who, despite playing no defense whatsoever, has provided some pretty damn good value for his team for a long time.


I'll give you a hint, that lefty DH has a nickname that rhymes with "Twig Moppy"

[Robinson for MVP]

Originally Posted by DaYooperASBDT

Best username in history. Welcome to the board!

Thanks!

[Robinson for MVP]

Originally Posted by The Truman Show

How about the team just trade for good players? The phrase "beggars can't be choosers" comes to mind. Plus, I can think of a certain lefty DH who, despite playing no defense whatsoever, has provided some pretty damn good value for his team for a long time.


I'll give you a hint, that lefty DH has a nickname that rhymes with "Twig Moppy"

Jim Thome?

[tigermojo]

Originally Posted by Robinson for MVP

Jim Thome?

Big Poppy.

[waffel]

Nationals GM Mike Rizzo insisted Tuesday that Adam Dunn will not be traded.
"We are not trading Adam Dunn," Rizzo said during an appearance on ESPN 980 in Washington, D.C. "That's as definitive as I can be." The Nationals are well out of contention in the NL East and might not compete for several years, if at all, but Dunn has a full year left on his two-year, $20 million deal and Rizzo would like to see him play it out.


There, now stop talking about Dunn.

[The Truman Show]

Originally Posted by waffel

Nationals GM Mike Rizzo insisted Tuesday that Adam Dunn will not be traded.
"We are not trading Adam Dunn," Rizzo said during an appearance on ESPN 980 in Washington, D.C. "That's as definitive as I can be." The Nationals are well out of contention in the NL East and might not compete for several years, if at all, but Dunn has a full year left on his two-year, $20 million deal and Rizzo would like to see him play it out.


There, now stop talking about Dunn.

Yeah, that makes absolutely no sense to me whatsoever, but, if that's what Mike Rizzo wants, whatever.

So how about Josh Willingham???

[Robinson for MVP]

Originally Posted by The Truman Show

Yeah, that makes absolutely no sense to me whatsoever, but, if that's what Mike Rizzo wants, whatever.

So how about Josh Willingham???

Or Nick Johnson, or Aubrey Huff, or Luke Scott

[VegasTiger]

Originally Posted by tigermojo

Big Poppy.

Whoooooooooooooooooooooosh

[itsallgood8989]

Originally Posted by The Truman Show

How about the team just trade for good players? The phrase "beggars can't be choosers" comes to mind. Plus, I can think of a certain lefty DH who, despite playing no defense whatsoever, has provided some pretty damn good value for his team for a long time.


I'll give you a hint, that lefty DH has a nickname that rhymes with "Twig Moppy"

You would really take Big Poppy and his contract? I repeat, you don't trade for a DH....

[tiger337]

Originally Posted by itsallgood8989

you don't trade for a DH....

Why? Teams trade for defensive specialists, lefty specialists, speed guys like Josh Anderson. Why not a DH? I'm not saying the Tigers should trade for a DH now. I'm asking why you NEVER trade for a DH.

[tigermojo]

Originally Posted by tiger337

Why? Teams trade for defensive specialists, lefty specialists, speed guys like Josh Anderson. Why not a DH? I'm not saying the Tigers should trade for a DH now. I'm asking why you NEVER trade for a DH.

It is forbidden.

[1984]

These are the guys I would be targeting in order:

1) Matt Holliday

2) Luke Scott

3) Whoever is the odd man out in Texas:
a. Marlon Byrd
b. Andruw Jones
or
c. David Murphy

Beyond these 5, I think we stand pat, unless the Dodgers would be willing to eat some of juan pierre's contract.

It appears Leyland is committed to a lineup like this in the second half:

Granderson
Polanco
Cabrera
Thames
Guillen
Inge
Thomas/Ordonez platoon
Laird
Everette/Santiago platoon

Where does this leave Rayburn and Anderson? Hopefully Anderson on the bench. Does Rayburn eventually supplant Ordonez in the right field platoon?

If we got one of the above bats in a trade who sits? Probably Thames or does the Thomas/Ordonez Platoon end? My guess is Guillen becomes DH, new guy takes left field and Thames sits.

[The Truman Show]

Originally Posted by itsallgood8989

You would really take Big Poppy and his contract? I repeat, you don't trade for a DH....

I didn't say "trade for Big Papi," dude. I simply used him as an example of a team getting extremely good value out of having a terrific DH who didn't do anything else. Jim Thome's another good example.

You don't make blanket statements like "don't trade for a DH." It ignores an integral part of the team, and also ignores valid possibilities of ways to improve a team.

[The Truman Show]

Any suggestion that involves acquiring Juan Pierre should be a bannable offense. Dear God no.

[1984]

Originally Posted by The Truman Show

Any suggestion that involves acquiring Juan Pierre should be a bannable offense. Dear God no.

Not my 1st or even my 5th choice, but if none of the other guys can be had, and the dodgers were willing to eat some dough, he is better than Maggs at this point. Not really what we need though, I agree -- we need someone with POP in his bat.

[sportz4life]

Originally Posted by 1984

Not my 1st or even my 5th choice, but if none of the other guys can be had, and the dodgers were willing to eat some dough, he is better than Maggs at this point. Not really what we need though, I agree -- we need someone with POP in his bat.

Barely

[Robinson for MVP]

I think it's time people realized that the DH can have quite a bit of value in his own right. The added benefit to a DH-type player is that you don't have to worry about diminishing skills in the field.

If Miguel Cabrera had to play the next 7 years or whatever of his contract as only the DH and he put up the .330, 35 HR, 125 RBI seasons he's known to put up, you mean to tell me he'd be substantially less valuable than as a first baseman? Not buying it.

Certainly, Joe Mauer is more valuable than a good Big Papi. But that doesn't mean there isn't value to the DH.

[Robinson for MVP]

to expand on my point, the reason you trade for a DH right now is that if you're the Tigers, you're unlikely to get a good hitter who is a better fielder than whoever is the every day starter at their position. i.e. the 2nd basemen who can hit AND field better than/the same as Polanco are not available, the shortstops that fit that with Everett are not available, etc. All the bats available are all basically crap fielders.

[itsallgood8989]

Originally Posted by tiger337

Why? Teams trade for defensive specialists, lefty specialists, speed guys like Josh Anderson. Why not a DH? I'm not saying the Tigers should trade for a DH now. I'm asking why you NEVER trade for a DH.

The reason you don't trade for a DH is that DH's are the easiest commodity to find in baseball. Baseball is full of guys whit guys that can hit and little else. If you trade a valuable commodity for a high commodity item, it is in effect selling high and buying low.

The Tigers as they currently stand have DH's in Guillien, Thames, Ordonez, Maybe Larrish, Strieby..... The Tigers also have the ability to use non traditional DH's in the way to rest guys. Situations where you want to rest an Inge or Polonco or Granderson but want to keep their bat in the lineup.

Think back to when we had Sheffield. Sheff was our everyday DH. Limited our lineup flexibility because he could not play anywhere else. If I recall, Leland made a statement to that effect when Sheffield was released. I highly suspect we may be stuck in the same position with Carlos. I highly doubt that Carlos will play in the field anymore, if he ever plays again.

There is always a hot bat, "flavor of the day." We need to keep roster flexibility and not trade valuable pieces for one dimensional players.

I can not remember a time where a trade for a DH worked out over the course of 2 seasons. I'm not sure of even one season, but I am sure there might be an example..... I guess Sheffield might be the best case.... and we ended up paying him to leave!

[itsallgood8989]

Originally Posted by Robinson for MVP

I think it's time people realized that the DH can have quite a bit of value in his own right. The added benefit to a DH-type player is that you don't have to worry about diminishing skills in the field.

If Miguel Cabrera had to play the next 7 years or whatever of his contract as only the DH and he put up the .330, 35 HR, 125 RBI seasons he's known to put up, you mean to tell me he'd be substantially less valuable than as a first baseman? Not buying it.

Certainly, Joe Mauer is more valuable than a good Big Papi. But that doesn't mean there isn't value to the DH.

This isn't really a debate on the value of a DH. The debate is on the value of trading for a DH.