2012 Pistons Offseason

[weaselpuppy]

The first of many moves I hope. SF depth chart is now Tayshaun, Maggette, Jerebko, CV, Wilkins(fa), Daye and Singler. Mayyybe 4 of those guys will be left standing. Maybe a trade up into late 1st for a tall SG or value PF/C?

[PuNk42AE]

Until V is amnesty claused I won't believe it happening.

[jonjd]

Regardless of the clearer direction we now have, I'm not getting too excited about anything yet. Joe D has already shown that he can have a ton of money to spend and have it go to waste. I'll admit it looks better than it has in the past couple years, but at the same time, that's not really saying much....

No question that I agree with you.

I will consider the Pistons in a much, much better place if they use the amnesty on Tayshaun. Does anyone see this happening? A stupid, stupid deal in the first place.

[Nastradamus]

They can't amnesty Tayshaun. He signed his deal after the CBA, it had to be signed before then to be eligible. Maggette and CV are our only worthwhile amnesty guys at this point.

[jonjd]

They can't amnesty Tayshaun. He signed his deal after the CBA, it had to be signed before then to be eligible. Maggette and CV are our only worthwhile amnesty guys at this point.

Right, thanks. This article is to blame.

Detroit flips Ben Gordon and a protected pick to the Charlotte Bobcats for Corey Maggette | Ball Don't Lie - Yahoo! Sports

I should have known better. Plus, CV makes all kinds of sense, naturally. We pretend 2009 never happened essentially.

[tigerz]

Dysfunctional Pistons lose Ben Gordon trade « PistonPowered

As that first-round picks hangs in limbo between Detroit and Charlotte – maybe even longer if the eventually drafted player does well for Bobcats– the Pistons are still operating in the shadow of July 1, 2009.

Necessary trade, better than the one that would have cost us Brandon Knight. It's still crumby that a team that was in position for most of the year to be at the top of the lottery before everyone else started to tank and still had t5th worst point differential in the NBA has to give up their 1st pick relatively soon.

[nikopolidis]

You cannot amnesty Maggette either fyi because we traded for him. CV is only realistic option to amnesty. Maxiell could also be included I guess, but his contract is way more bareable than CV's.

[mickeyb105]

The first of many moves I hope. SF depth chart is now Tayshaun, Maggette, Jerebko, CV, Wilkins(fa), Daye and Singler. Mayyybe 4 of those guys will be left standing. Maybe a trade up into late 1st for a tall SG or value PF/C?

This is definitely an interesting numbers game, as some of these guys have value and some have negative value. Let's look at these guys:

Prince: He's slightly overpaid for his production and he would be of better use on a championship contender. A nice fit would be the Lakers or Dallas, as he would be a better fit than anyone they could draft in the first round. Would we have to package one (both?) of our second round picks with him and eat some of his salary? How nice would it be to have two first rounders in this draft, get some short and long-term salary relief, and relieve some of our log-jam at swingman?

Jerebko: JJ would be a very marketable player, imo, in the trade market. Unfortunately, he represents our most dependable bench player going into next season. JJ, in some ways, represents everything we would want in a combo forward who can either come off the bench or start—he's cheap, he always gives 100%, he's versatile and he's skilled. I would hate to see him go.

Maggette: CG is past his prime and injury prone at 33. He's got one more year left on an $11m contract, and when healthy this guy can really score. Unfortunately, in spite of his once-great physical gifts, CG never turned into a great all-around player. I blame that on only playing one year of college, where he didn't even have a starring role. He would be attractive for a team looking to trade an overloaded position player for an expiring contract.

Charlie V: The class clown of the team, his value is at an all-time low. At one time, he would have been a good role player on a contender. Maybe with some hard work, he could still be—but that would mean he would actually have to put in hard work (unlikely). It is hard to believe this guy ever scored 51 points in an NBA game. He is an amnesty candidate as much for symbolic reasons as he is for financial reasons. If Dumars can trade him for anything that could help the team, I would be thrilled and shocked.

Daye: Nobody knows what to make of this guy other than that he has been pretty unproductive in the NBA so far. He teases with occasional great shooting displays, he grabs your attention with grabbing a bunch of rebounds from the wing, and then he goes into a funk. He was supposed to be the heir apparent to Prince, but now he's just his stunt double. Guys like Daye have found homes where they've been productive (Tony Campbell comes to mind) in the past, but he would certainly have negative trade value at this point.

Singler: Singler, right now, is a poor man's Jerebko. He's shorter than JJ, and has a smaller build. But, he's a high-effort player who can shoot the ball and do all the little things right. He could have some value as a throw in to a bigger deal, but his biggest value may come if we are forced to trade Jerebko for a "bigger picture" type of deal. It is probably fair to call Singler insurance at this point.

My overall feeling, combined with last night's dealing of Gordon, is that the Pistons are going to try and get a second first round pick. I don't know if that means them moving down from 9 AND moving up from the upper-second round, or if it means we get to keep our current pick, but I really feel Dumars is putting a lot of emphasis into this draft and off-season.

[mickeyb105]

Dysfunctional Pistons lose Ben Gordon trade « PistonPowered



Necessary trade, better than the one that would have cost us Brandon Knight. It's still crumby that a team that was in position for most of the year to be at the top of the lottery before everyone else started to tank and still had t5th worst point differential in the NBA has to give up their 1st pick relatively soon.

That story was a real turd and completely negative. If the writer wanted to do a story on the demise of the Pistons or on how bad of a GM Dumars had been over the past 8 or 9 seasons, then he should have written that story. Saying the trade was bad is very short-sighted, and he showed it by having to reference the past.

[4hzglory]

Dysfunctional Pistons lose Ben Gordon trade « PistonPowered

That article has a bunch of poorly written parts.

The Pistons are selling this trade as a way to clear cap room – and it will, to the tune of $13.2 million next summer. But if cap room was the real goal, the obvious step would have been amnestying Gordon.

If they are truly trying to clear cap, they need to get rid of CV and Gordon. Gordon was the only one who was tradeable, so this gives them the option (by using the amnesty on CV) of getting them both off the cap. Amnestying Gordon and keeping CV would have just been stupid. Now if they don't amnesty or buy out CV, then the cap argument dies somewhat, but this does actually save $14-15 million in cash which amnestying does not. Is that worth a draft pick to open up playing time to players who are in the long range plans? I definitely think so.

The issue isn’t paying Gordon. That’s a sunk cost. The problem is paying his replacement. The larger the amnestied contract for a team under the luxury tax, the more that team – at least if its trying to win – will spend on a replacement. Basically, a team pays around double in real dollars for the roster slot of an amnestied player.

Huh? They only pay double in real dollars if they actually spend the same amount on the amnestied player's replacement. Amnestying anyone by themselves wouldn't have gotten us under the cap this season anyhow. The issue is next season where now they have the option of being rid of both contracts cap wise and Gordon's in real $. Yes they would be paying for CV's replacement, but what is better, paying CV to sit on the bench and be the influence he has been to the young players or paying a player league minimum to take his spot on the bench and maybe develop into something?

The Pistons must believe they’ll make the playoffs next season to make this trade, and they should think they have a good chance of winning a round if they were willing to draw the protection line at 14.

I saw the same thing in the Detroit News Article and this doesn't make any sense to me. IMO, the complete lottery protection for next year shows me they think there is a decent chance they won't make the playoffs as if they make them, they lose their pick. It looks like they think they will make the playoffs in 2014 to have only a top 8 protection.

Another possible benefit from this trade. Hopefully in getting Maggette, an experienced SF, Dumars will be willing to lower his demands and move Prince.

[4hzglory]

I should add, obviously the initial signings of CV and Gordon were foolish and led to this trade, but based on the past 3 years, this trade was much better than doing nothing but waiting for 2 more years. This gives the potential for significant progress in the 2013-14 season where waiting would have slowed that another year.

[qsilvr2531]

This is definitely an interesting numbers game, as some of these guys have value and some have negative value. Let's look at these guys:

Prince: He's slightly overpaid for his production and he would be of better use on a championship contender. A nice fit would be the Lakers or Dallas, as he would be a better fit than anyone they could draft in the first round. Would we have to package one (both?) of our second round picks with him and eat some of his salary? How nice would it be to have two first rounders in this draft, get some short and long-term salary relief, and relieve some of our log-jam at swingman?

Jerebko: JJ would be a very marketable player, imo, in the trade market. Unfortunately, he represents our most dependable bench player going into next season. JJ, in some ways, represents everything we would want in a combo forward who can either come off the bench or start—he's cheap, he always gives 100%, he's versatile and he's skilled. I would hate to see him go.

Maggette: CG is past his prime and injury prone at 33. He's got one more year left on an $11m contract, and when healthy this guy can really score. Unfortunately, in spite of his once-great physical gifts, CG never turned into a great all-around player. I blame that on only playing one year of college, where he didn't even have a starring role. He would be attractive for a team looking to trade an overloaded position player for an expiring contract.

Charlie V: The class clown of the team, his value is at an all-time low. At one time, he would have been a good role player on a contender. Maybe with some hard work, he could still be—but that would mean he would actually have to put in hard work (unlikely). It is hard to believe this guy ever scored 51 points in an NBA game. He is an amnesty candidate as much for symbolic reasons as he is for financial reasons. If Dumars can trade him for anything that could help the team, I would be thrilled and shocked.

Daye: Nobody knows what to make of this guy other than that he has been pretty unproductive in the NBA so far. He teases with occasional great shooting displays, he grabs your attention with grabbing a bunch of rebounds from the wing, and then he goes into a funk. He was supposed to be the heir apparent to Prince, but now he's just his stunt double. Guys like Daye have found homes where they've been productive (Tony Campbell comes to mind) in the past, but he would certainly have negative trade value at this point.

Singler: Singler, right now, is a poor man's Jerebko. He's shorter than JJ, and has a smaller build. But, he's a high-effort player who can shoot the ball and do all the little things right. He could have some value as a throw in to a bigger deal, but his biggest value may come if we are forced to trade Jerebko for a "bigger picture" type of deal. It is probably fair to call Singler insurance at this point.

My overall feeling, combined with last night's dealing of Gordon, is that the Pistons are going to try and get a second first round pick. I don't know if that means them moving down from 9 AND moving up from the upper-second round, or if it means we get to keep our current pick, but I really feel Dumars is putting a lot of emphasis into this draft and off-season.

I guess I don't understand the issue with Jerebko. He's not particularly old or expensive and seems like a good fit on the team going forward. Why would we trade him and what are we going to get for him that will provide more value than he does? He's the only SF on our roster that is worth keeping going forward? Is his contract up soon?

[qsilvr2531]

I should add, obviously the initial signings of CV and Gordon were foolish and led to this trade, but based on the past 3 years, this trade was much better than doing nothing but waiting for 2 more years. This gives the potential for significant progress in the 2013-14 season where waiting would have slowed that another year.

At the end of the day we traded a 1st round pick to get salary relief in the future. That's not exactly something to be excited about.

[4hzglory]

At the end of the day we traded a 1st round pick to get salary relief in the future. That's not exactly something to be excited about.

First of all, we traded a future first round pick to get salary relief now and in the future. It doesn't make me excited, but much better than paying someone who doesn't fit an extra $14-15 million over the next 2 seasons. It gives us cap flexibility a year earlier. If it enables us to trade either Maggette or Prince for a future pick it is even better. It stinks that we got to this place with the initial signings, but I am glad Dumars made this trade rather than passing on it and hanging on to Gordon and the future pick.

[qsilvr2531]

First of all, we traded a future first round pick to get salary relief now and in the future. It doesn't make me excited, but much better than paying someone who doesn't fit an extra $14-15 million over the next 2 seasons. It gives us cap flexibility a year earlier. If it enables us to trade either Maggette or Prince for a future pick it is even better. It stinks that we got to this place with the initial signings, but I am glad Dumars made this trade rather than passing on it and hanging on to Gordon and the future pick.

I'm not saying it's a bad deal. We had to do it. But we had to do it because we are in a terrible position and making the move doesn't put us in a good position or anything, it just helps us get out from under the terrible position we were in. Was it a necessary move? Almost certainly but, to me, it's just another reminder of the shape we are in right now.

I don't see how we can trade Maggette for a pick when the Bobcats had to take on Gordon for us to give them a first round pick for Maggette.

Last of all, I don't think trading a past first round pick is possible so obviously we traded a future first round pick.

[4hzglory]

I'm not saying it's a bad deal. We had to do it. But we had to do it because we are in a terrible position and making the move doesn't put us in a good position or anything, it just helps us get out from under the terrible position we were in. Was it a necessary move? Almost certainly but, to me, it's just another reminder of the shape we are in right now.

I don't see how we can trade Maggette for a pick when the Bobcats had to take on Gordon for us to give them a first round pick for Maggette.

I think the Bobcats were looking for outside shooting and a legitimate NBA player - which Gordon can be. I don't know that they had to take him on to get a first for Maggette. This way they got both the first and filled one of many needs. Saying that, I do think it would be hard to trade Maggette by himself for a pick as a team would have to both want him and have approx $10 mil in cap room or trade exception. A contract of some sort would likely have to come back. I would much rather trade Prince, and keep Maggette for the season, but Maggette's large expiring contract could be valuable in another trade.

Edited to change Gordon from a legitimate starter to legitimate player.

[Hart]

Regardless of the clearer direction we now have, I'm not getting too excited about anything yet. Joe D has already shown that he can have a ton of money to spend and have it go to waste. I'll admit it looks better than it has in the past couple years, but at the same time, that's not really saying much....

I agree with this.

The best players are not going to want to play in Detroit...they will go to Boston or Chicago or New York or Dallas. That means we will probably be overpaying for guys like Gordon and CV again. We really need Monroe and Knight to have big years next year to try and convince the better free agents Detroit would be a good destination to go to.

[Hart]

I think this deal makes the Prince signing look even worse...I would love to unload his contract (or even Stuckey's) before next offseason now.

[DrWho17]

Following on the last posters line of thinking, my thoughts were when I heard this trade that Dumars doesn't like any of the bigs, and is going to go after Waiters, he did it for draft options.

My second thought was that we were going to ship out Prince to try to move up in the draft to go after Drummond or someone, hopefully dump Daye as well, I do not believe there is anyway to get rid of Villenueva.

Edit: Another conspiracy theory I heard is that Dumars is trying to keep some of the teams in front of them 6/7/8 from trading down to get the guy they want, since they were thinking the Pistons were locked in to a big man, a move to keep Drummond in play to 9.

[4hzglory]

I think this deal makes the Prince signing look even worse...I would love to unload his contract (or even Stuckey's) before next offseason now.

I never understood the Prince signing. For what Stuckey signed for, I am ok with him as either the starting 2 or 1st guy off the bench.

[Betrayer]

I have to say I'm torn on this trade.

On one hand, I really did want to get rid of Gordon and his contract. He's undersized in an already undersized backcourt, he doesn't offer any defense, and the one thing he does offer has been streaky at best. If Maggette plays, he'll actually be an upgrade in many ways. We need to get bigger and tougher and dropping Gordon does that whether Maggette remains here or not.

One the other hand, at the end of the day all we've done is shed one year worth of a contract in trade for a first rounder. For a rebuilding team, I'm not sure if that makes me happy. Especially when you consider how tradeable Gordon's contract would have become next year anyway. It also scares me from the perspective of whether Gores is thinking with his wallet or thinking about this team. Does this money motivated move also mean that he wouldn't buy a trade or amnesty CV?

In the end, I guess I'm just happy to see Joe trying to make a change here and fix his screw ups. That's a good thing. Hopefully this is just the beginning though. I still want to see something happen on draft day hopefully to get us another 1st rounder. And, of course, we still have CV and Daye on the roster...

[4hzglory]

On one hand, I really did want to get rid of Gordon and his contract. He's undersized in an already undersized backcourt, he doesn't offer any defense, and the one thing he does offer has been streaky at best. If Maggette plays, he'll actually be an upgrade in many ways. We need to get bigger and tougher and dropping Gordon does that whether Maggette remains here or not.

Agree completely

One the other hand, at the end of the day all we've done is shed one year worth of a contract in trade for a first rounder. For a rebuilding team, I'm not sure if that makes me happy. Especially when you consider how tradeable Gordon's contract would have become next year anyway.

If we would have traded this years 1st or next years no matter what I would agree, but we traded what will likely be a 1st in 2014 for a benefit we receive now and next year. As far as the tradeability of Godon's contract next year, why is Maggette's this year any less valuable? I'd much rather not signed Gordon at all, but at this point I am very happy with this trade compared to the alternative.

It also scares me from the perspective of whether Gores is thinking with his wallet or thinking about this team. Does this money motivated move also mean that he wouldn't buy a trade or amnesty CV?

I am encouraged by this trade as it makes me believe Gores wants to have the $ available to make changes sooner rather than later.

[mickeyb105]

I guess I don't understand the issue with Jerebko. He's not particularly old or expensive and seems like a good fit on the team going forward. Why would we trade him and what are we going to get for him that will provide more value than he does? He's the only SF on our roster that is worth keeping going forward? Is his contract up soon?

I have no issue at all with Jerebko, he's one of my favorite player on the team.

Sorry if I didn't convey this clearly enough in my post, but I would only move JJ if he were part of a big deal which would land us more pieces we needed. What we have at SF isn't ideal, especially without Jerebko, but if we can use him as a chip to upgrade our bigs either via the draft or off someone else's roster—that's not a bad move IMO.

I hope it doesn't come to that, though, and we can make a second first rounder happen another way.

[ScrubBeaterUpper]

Following on the last posters line of thinking, my thoughts were when I heard this trade that Dumars doesn't like any of the bigs, and is going to go after Waiters, he did it for draft options.

My second thought was that we were going to ship out Prince to try to move up in the draft to go after Drummond or someone, hopefully dump Daye as well, I do not believe there is anyway to get rid of Villenueva.

Edit: Another conspiracy theory I heard is that Dumars is trying to keep some of the teams in front of them 6/7/8 from trading down to get the guy they want, since they were thinking the Pistons were locked in to a big man, a move to keep Drummond in play to 9.

I'd take Waiters over Henson.

[Betrayer]

You've also got to wonder what the long term plan is in Joe's mind. If he uses the amnesty on CV, he's looking at nearly 30 mil in cap next offseason. An offseason that includes such free agents as Dwight Howard and Andrew Bynum. Interesting.

Does Joe think he has the pull to get that kind of player to come to Detroit? If so, maybe moving BG means Joe has his eyes on a SG in the draft and is going to hope to get Monroe's front court mate with the cap space. It'd be a risky move considering how difficult it is to get big name players to come here of their own free will.

It's not a gamble that I'd take but looking at the 2013 free agent class I'm not sure where else Joe could go with this money that he's freeing up. That's a lot of money and there are only a few big names out there.

On a positive note, the fact that we're even talking about all of these options is exciting rather than having to talk about being locked into bad contracts for years to come. It's good to see that Joe is doing something, now let's see if he can seal the deal by making this draft a success, grabbing an extra pick, and doing something with the 2013 money, or find out if he's going to pull another 2009.

[Nastradamus]

I have no issue at all with Jerebko, he's one of my favorite player on the team.

Sorry if I didn't convey this clearly enough in my post, but I would only move JJ if he were part of a big deal which would land us more pieces we needed. What we have at SF isn't ideal, especially without Jerebko, but if we can use him as a chip to upgrade our bigs either via the draft or off someone else's roster—that's not a bad move IMO.

I hope it doesn't come to that, though, and we can make a second first rounder happen another way.

I like Jerebko, but I wouldn't hesitate to trade him for value. He's a bit of a tweener and he's not a starter in this league. I like his effort, rebounding and spot shooting, but his value only goes so far. I wonder if he could be part of a Josh Smith package or something like that. Probably not without a 1st next year.

[RJBBREZ]

In the end, I guess I'm just happy to see Joe trying to make a change here and fix his screw ups. That's a good thing. Hopefully this is just the beginning though. I still want to see something happen on draft day hopefully to get us another 1st rounder. And, of course, we still have CV and Daye on the roster...

This is how I feel. Hopefully it is the first of many moves to improve this team.

[Betrayer]

Max picked up his option

And now he's tradeable as an expiring contract. Package him and a second rounder (or two) to move back into the first.

[DaBishop]

Maybe package Prince and a 2nd Rounder to move up in the first round? Could a team like Orlando use him?

[DTroppens]

I have to say I'm torn on this trade..

I cut a lot of your post out just to save room. A lot of what you said is exactly what I thought when I heard of the trade.

This trade gets rid of Gordon, a non-valued entity that was hurting the squad more than helping it's present and future. But through a trade, he actually hurts the game even more with the loss of an eventual draft pick. Yeah, the money is loosened up after next season, but it took losing a draft pick to get that. And it was Dumars' screw-up in the first place.

I am not happy or sad about the trade. I just look at it like this - the Pistons were forced to regress once again in order to have a chance to move forward. And that's sad.

Magette won't be playing on this team by the end of January. He'll either be hurt, or there will be no value to playing a guy in his 30s who has no future on your team.

[DTroppens]

Max picked up his option

And now he's tradeable as an expiring contract. Package him and a second rounder (or two) to move back into the first.

Why would anyone want Max and a second rounder and lose a first-round pick. There's a ton more potential value in keeping that draft pick.

[DTroppens]

Maybe package Prince and a 2nd Rounder to move up in the first round? Could a team like Orlando use him?

Something like that is much more likely.

[Betrayer]

Why would anyone want Max and a second rounder and lose a first-round pick. There's a ton more potential value in keeping that draft pick.

Because first round picks are guaranteed salary and there are plenty of teams looking to shed dollars for business/cap reasons. Max represents an expiring contract on top of that. At the end of day this is a business. Which is probably the same reason that we gave up a first rounder to net just one year of salary and why CV probably won't get amnesty.

[mickeyb105]

I like Jerebko, but I wouldn't hesitate to trade him for value. He's a bit of a tweener and he's not a starter in this league. I like his effort, rebounding and spot shooting, but his value only goes so far.

I agree with this. I don't hate him starting, but off the bench he's downright valuable.

[Betrayer]

So, my question now is what does Joe do with the cash next season? Unless Monroe turns into Tim Duncan this season, all of that money is not for him. We just drafted Drummond, so we probably won't be looking to get into the Howard or Bynum race. We're counting on Knight to be the PG of the future, so we won't be looking at CP3. Tyreke Evans is probably in the same boat.

Ibaka could be out there and since he's not a superstar type might not mind being added to the front court of Monroe and Drummond. Wow, would we be deep and defensive at that position.

Hardin could also be out there. But he seems to fit the Jason Terry mold and I'm not sure if he's your starting SG type.

Optimally, we'd want to spend that money to get a go to guy at the SG/SF position, but I don't see any player like that available.

2013 free agents

I just don't want to see another CV/BG off season where Joe spends this money poorly.

[Nastradamus]

Well to get this out of the way, Harden is most certainly a starting SG in this league. There aren't more than 3 SGs better than him right now IMHO and he plays a Jason Terry role because of the team he's on. Harden is probably a max contract guy. He was 4th in the NBA this past year in win shares per 48, behind Lebron,Durant and Paul. I'd sign him in a heartbeat if it could be done.

I'm not sure the money is for anyone or anything though. I think its about flexibility to build the best team possible. We can take a guy on in a trade, explore free agency and/or re-sign our own guys.

[mickeyb105]

Harden played great basketball this year, and I expect him to be everything Mo Pete was supposed to be coming out of MSU.

I agree with Nas, he could very well be a max contract guy. The question is, where would he want to go to be that team's #1 option. He'll only be happy so long as a #3 option and 6th man--he's way too young to resign to being Eddie Johnson (but there are worse things you could be).

[Betrayer]

I just don't see it yet. Maybe he's still young and maturing, but I watched a lot of OKC this year and all of their playoff games.

Harden is a specialist. He's a black hole scorer and nothing else. He's either on or off and is not a willing passer. He also gets torched defensively. That makes him the perfect fit for a contender that needs a starting caliber scorer off the bench. So, while I agree that he could start for many teams based upon his talents as a scorer, he's not the guy I'd want for my max contract option from the 2/3 position. He doesn't have the all around game for that.

Please don't get me wrong, I love watching him play on offense and what he gives OKC. I just wouldn't give him a max contract to be my star. I don't think he's that player.

[qsilvr2531]

I just don't see it yet. Maybe he's still young and maturing, but I watched a lot of OKC this year and all of their playoff games.

Harden is a specialist. He's a black hole scorer and nothing else. He's either on or off and is not a willing passer. He also gets torched defensively. That makes him the perfect fit for a contender that needs a starting caliber scorer off the bench. So, while I agree that he could start for many teams based upon his talents as a scorer, he's not the guy I'd want for my max contract option from the 2/3 position. He doesn't have the all around game for that.

Please don't get me wrong, I love watching him play on offense and what he gives OKC. I just wouldn't give him a max contract to be my star. I don't think he's that player.

He's a good passer and rebounder for a SG and last year he was able to cut the fouls down. And while he can be either on or off so can any scorer, he's still an extremely efficient scorer (above average eFG% and an excellent TS%). He's the opposite of guys like Gordon and CV, who were volume shooters that weren't (and are) terribly efficient. He's not an ideal star but I think he's probably the best we could hope to land given the fact that we can't outspend anyone to draw someone to Detroit.

[Betrayer]

...we can't outspend anyone to draw someone to Detroit.

Actually, we can. We just can't hope to attract anyone because nobody wants to come here.

Salary

Detroit will have 30 mil available if they don't amnesty CV and 38 mil available if they do. Granted, Drummond will have a few mil of that and you have to have other players on your roster. But, even if you give Monroe a 10 mil contract, you still have enough to offer a max contract to some player.

That much money in Joe D's hands with most players not interested in coming here...I'll guess we'll see what happens.