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  1. #41
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    Brandon Knight was the right pick, but far from a perfect one for the Detroit Pistons PistonPowered

    Good article about the pick. A little preview, but a lot more at the link.

    There’s just one problem: he wasn’t very good at playing basketball last year. He hit some big shots and showed raw talent, and he’s young. I’m certainly not writing him off. But that doesn’t just the fact that Knight wasn’t that good last year.

    Here’s how the he ranked among the 22 point guards in DraftExpress’ top 100:

    • Points per 40 minutes, pace adjusted: 14th
    • Assists per 40 minutes, pace adjusted: 15th
    • Offensive-rebounding percentage: 16th
    • Defensive-rebounding percentage: 10th
    • Steals per 40 minutes, pace adjusted: 23rd
    • Blocks per 40 minutes, pace adjusted: 7th (seven-way tie)
    • Turnovers per 40 minutes, pace adjusted: 17th (three-way tie)
    • Personal fouls per 40 minutes, pace adjusted: 13th (five-way tie)
    • 2-point percentage: 17th (tie)
    • 3-point percentage: 12th
    • Free-throw percentage: 13th
    • Assist-to-turnover ratio: 18th
    • Points per play: 15th
    • Free-throw attempt per field-goal attempt: 16th


    That’s the résumé of someone who should have the expectations for him dialed down, not up, like the Pistons are doing. It didn’t stop with the Billups comparison, either.

  2. #42
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    I love how they ranked 22 pgs in the draft yet they list him as the 23rd best in steals per 40. He was worse than nobody?

    I watched a lot of Kentucky last year, Knight is a good player with strong potential, Im happy we got him at 8.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Betrayer View Post
    No kidding.

    Someone mentioned a 3 guard rotation of Knight, Gordon, and Stuckey...who is that squad of midgets going to defend?

    I don't know if Knight will grow into a PG. Personally I would have preferred Walker because he seems to have "it".

    How does it work to call the three guard rotation "midgets" and then say you preferred the guy who 2 to 3 inches shorter than the one they drafted?
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  4. #44
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    Need4Sheed.com has announced the official snack of the Detroit Pistons.


  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deleterious View Post
    Discuss.
    We had a softball game that was cancelled yesterday. The other team just didnt show up so we practiced and then went out to watch the rest of the draft. We got there and it was pick 4 so we had front row seats for this pick. My buddy was happy with it. He wanted either of the 2 PG at that spot. I had to acquiesce to him though because I am not that up on my college basketball.

    He was happy so in turn I thought we had a good pick. He really knows his college sports.
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  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deleterious View Post
    Need4Sheed.com has announced the official snack of the Detroit Pistons.

    Now that's funny.
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    "I'm going to go the Pistons' game tonight and watch Sheed jack up threes." -unknown

  7. #47
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    2011 NBA Draft Winners and Losers - CBSSports.com


    Individual Losers:

    Brandon Knight: Plummeted due to his attitude and wound up in dysfunctional Detroit.
    Eh?

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deleterious View Post
    Individual Winners:

    Joe Dumars: Lucks into Brandon Knight. Rodney Stuckey problem: solved

    In the same article? I don't get it either.



    ???
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  9. #49
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    after much googling...

    We?re talking about attitude?
    Teams were just concerned that he wouldn’t work out against Kemba Walker and Jimmer Fredette. The logic in the decision seemed to be sound, as Knight really had nothing to gain by working out against guys projected to go lower than him. He still went ahead of them. It was just lower than expected.
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  10. #50
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    So really there was no attitude problem. Individual work outs might be the most overrated evaluating tool available. They played a college basketball season for a reason, so we could watch them play.

    Im very satisfied with the Knight pick. Now I expect Joe to make some significant roster changes. And I find it a cheap shot from the person who called the pistons dysfunctional while not clarifying the recent changes; new owner, fired bad coach, a long leash to make personnel decisions.

    Pistons wont be good for a few years, we all know that, but its not like were the Clippers of the NBA, this is a storied franchise. We sucked after Joe and Isiah, and we suck after Chauncey and Rip (I expect Rip will be moving this off-season). Were rebuilding.

  11. #51
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    I think he simply fell because teams gambled on all the talented bigs in this draft. They might all be busts, but Kanter,Valanciunas,Thompson,Biyombo and vessely all are big guys who have huge boom or bust potential to some degree. Bigs are valuable and this draft could change the NBA to some degree. Or it could make the hate for drafting Euros go through the roof.

    Speaking of Vessely, the Wizards had easily the best draft. Him and Singleton as their Fs is an incredible amount of length,d and athleticism. Vessely's in game dunks are Blake Griffin-esque. Those guys will paly great off Wall. That whole team has length andathleticm with Young and Mcgee filling the other 2 starting spots plus guys like Blatche,Booker etc. I love Mack for them off the bench too. Guys a winner.

    We may suck for a while, but we also may not be that far from contending. It depends how Knight looks of course. These young PGs have been coming in and making big impacts lately. We get Jerebko back and Monroe should make a big step. If we can get a starting F for Rip/Gordon some how, we aren't in terrible shape. I like our roster entering the 2012 season particularly.

  12. #52
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    I like the Knight pick. The kid had a 4.3 GPA in high school...an intelligent player on the court is invaluable, especially when he's the point guard. Plus, he has the ability to score himself, averaging over 30pts a game in HS and leading freshmen scorers in the NCAA. I also like the Singler selection, I think he'll be a hard-working, high-character player who could eventually fill into a valuable 6th or 7th player role. Knight/Stuckey/Tay?/Monroe/Jerebko gives us a good start. I wonder if picking a Kentucky kid will influence Tayshaun's decision or not...probably not.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by T&P_Fan View Post
    I had Knight rated in the top 5 in overall talent, and I didnt even discuss him as one of the Pistons options because I didnt think he would be available. Knight can shoot the ball well and create off the dribble. I dont know where all these rumors are coming from that he cant handle the ball. He can score with either hand and attack the rim, you have to be able to handle the ball to do that. We will see what his passing ability is all about.
    Well, he does have a Darius Morris like left hand, so both hands is a bit generous . Not a major concern as long as he works, but it is a current weakness.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nastradamus View Post
    Well, he does have a Darius Morris like left hand, so both hands is a bit generous . Not a major concern as long as he works, but it is a current weakness.
    Morris has no left hand, Knight had a serviceable left hand. But he does need to work on it, and I am sure he will.

  15. #55
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    I feel they both have no left hand at this point. Both will improve though so I don't really care that much

  16. #56
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    I still don't know what the heck this team is going to do with 1 shooting guard and 3 tweener guards but hopefully Knight develops into a true PG. As much as I talk about getting rid of him, I think Rip is the better fit for the team, but that's probably because he's the only one of them that has a true position. Maybe with a defined role and a true PG he can settle back into being what he was.

    What I've finally decided I am sure about however is that I'm glad we didn't get Bismark. I don't think I want a guy billed as the next Ben Wallace. Ben Wallace's aren't drafted to be Ben Wallace's. They're guys who find their roles on the floor, work hard and become Ben Wallace's. They're guys like Dennis Rodman and Bruce Bowen(I'm assuming, don't really know what the scoop was on him coming out of college), ...they're guys who just put in the work and become special at what they do. Just MHO
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  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaBishop View Post
    I still don't know what the heck this team is going to do with 1 shooting guard and 3 tweener guards but hopefully Knight develops into a true PG. As much as I talk about getting rid of him, I think Rip is the better fit for the team, but that's probably because he's the only one of them that has a true position. Maybe with a defined role and a true PG he can settle back into being what he was.

    What I've finally decided I am sure about however is that I'm glad we didn't get Bismark. I don't think I want a guy billed as the next Ben Wallace. Ben Wallace's aren't drafted to be Ben Wallace's. They're guys who find their roles on the floor, work hard and become Ben Wallace's. They're guys like Dennis Rodman and Bruce Bowen(I'm assuming, don't really know what the scoop was on him coming out of college), ...they're guys who just put in the work and become special at what they do. Just MHO
    Pretty good Bruce Bowen analogy considering you didnt know his past, nice job.

    FWIW, Bowen was undrafted and played 4 years overseas before playing in the NBA.

  18. #58
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    Well, originally it was said Knight would wear #0. But I guess he held up a #7 jersey today at the presser. Maybe he didn't know BG was switching to #8. Singler will wear #25.

  19. #59
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    Here is the best video I have seen of Knight. It includes both some good things and bad things. I think the Utah announcer who breaks down the film is a little biased in favor of Knight because he was such a strong candidate for Utah at one point but the video itself is fair:

    YouTube - ‪brandon knight‬‏

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    Quote Originally Posted by T&P_Fan View Post
    I had Knight rated in the top 5 in overall talent, and I didnt even discuss him as one of the Pistons options because I didnt think he would be available. Knight can shoot the ball well and create off the dribble. I dont know where all these rumors are coming from that he cant handle the ball. He can score with either hand and attack the rim, you have to be able to handle the ball to do that. We will see what his passing ability is all about.
    When you compare him to NBA level point guards in ball handling, I think he needs a lot of improvement. He is not going to be able to attack the rim in traffic in the NBA. But that is as much because of his lack of explosiveness as it is his ball handling. I do think his ball handling will be sufficient enough at some point for him to get in the lane and create for himself or his teammates. He is just going to have to be very smart and creative.

  21. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hart View Post
    Here is the best video I have seen of Knight. It includes both some good things and bad things. I think the Utah announcer who breaks down the film is a little biased in favor of Knight because he was such a strong candidate for Utah at one point but the video itself is fair:

    YouTube - ‪brandon knight‬‏
    Hard to get excited by this guy from his tape. Can't get to the rim, not a great 1 on 1 guy, not a great playmaker, he's young, maybe the playmakering comes, but I don't like this pick at all. HIs saving grace is a pretty good midrange game with floaters, ala Tony Parker.
    Last edited by ScrubBeaterUpper; 06-25-2011 at 07:57 PM.

  22. #62
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    Draft and logic -wise, I have no problem with the selection. All of the mocks had him going much earlier. Of course it's not the position addition that the team needs right now but it's not much of a team right now anyway. Take the BPA is always the best policy.

  23. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Porcelain God View Post
    Draft and logic -wise, I have no problem with the selection. All of the mocks had him going much earlier. Of course it's not the position addition that the team needs right now but it's not much of a team right now anyway. Take the BPA is always the best policy.
    I have eased my stance a little bit on the Knight pick simply because we really only had two options: Knight or Walker. Rationally, I don't think one player is the clear cut pick over the other. I would guess that maybe 60% of GM's would have taken Knight with that selection and 40% would have taken Walker.

  24. #64
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    He's young enough and has the skills necessary to drastically change the way he plays basketball and become a very productive player, but he wasn't even that good for Kentucky last year. He's got a very long way to go. It was a weak draft and I don't really know that Walker is a much better pick, but I don't think the Pistons helped themselves much in this draft.
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  25. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by qsilvr2531 View Post
    He's young enough and has the skills necessary to drastically change the way he plays basketball and become a very productive player, but he wasn't even that good for Kentucky last year. He's got a very long way to go. It was a weak draft and I don't really know that Walker is a much better pick, but I don't think the Pistons helped themselves much in this draft.
    I wouldn't go as far as saying he wasn't even that good. At the bare minimum he was the leading scorer on the team, and against ranked teams his numbers were almost always leading the way.

    Then through the tournament, first game was bad, but the only shot he hit was the game winner. He carried Kentucky in the second game against WVU. The next game against Ohio State wasn't great, but again, he hit a big shot at the end to win the game. Carried the team against UNC to get to the Final Four. Then they lost a one point game to a red hot UConn team, who as we all know ended up winning it all.

    Kentucky doesn't end up getting as far as they did without Knight. Him & Jones pretty much were that team for most of the year.
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  26. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by EatEmUpTigers711 View Post
    I wouldn't go as far as saying he wasn't even that good. At the bare minimum he was the leading scorer on the team, and against ranked teams his numbers were almost always leading the way.

    Then through the tournament, first game was bad, but the only shot he hit was the game winner. He carried Kentucky in the second game against WVU. The next game against Ohio State wasn't great, but again, he hit a big shot at the end to win the game. Carried the team against UNC to get to the Final Four. Then they lost a one point game to a red hot UConn team, who as we all know ended up winning it all.

    Kentucky doesn't end up getting as far as they did without Knight. Him & Jones pretty much were that team for most of the year.
    He was the leading scorer because he took lots of shots. Among the guys in UK's primary rotation, he had the lowest shooting percentage and was middle of the pack in 3pt%. Many of which were not good shots. His effort on D was decent but he didn't regularly get steals, blocks or rebounds and also didn't get as many deflections as you'd like from a guy with his wing span. He also turns the ball over to much. I don't mean to say he wasn't good as a college player (which, looking back, is what it sounded like) but as far as first round draft picks go, his performance wasn't particularly good.

    As a point guard being only an OK shooter isn't necessarily a bad thing but in college he was a shooting guard playing the point because there weren't any better options. If he's that kind of player in the NBA he's not going to be very good.
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  27. #67
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    Knight was a PG that had a 1:1 A:TO ratio. That is about all you need to know.

  28. #68
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    Didn't he have season splits?

    Sucked at first, came on strong later in the season?
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    PS: I ran the #'s, don't have them with me... but IIRC from my calc's:

    Knight's shooting %'s went down after Dec 31st (51% on 2-pointers pre, 42% on 2's post-12/31; FT% went up from 77% to 80%, 3-pters down from 38% to 37%), but his rebounds, assists, and assist-TO ratio went up. Also his minutes, which would explain the rise in rebounds and assists. But his PF's went down too.

    Assist ratio up till 12/31: 1 to 1.
    After 12/31: 1.52 to 1.

    Not great... but I think the kid has lots of room (and capability) to improve. Just my 'pinion.
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    PS: Before the season started the top 2 on my wish list were Valanciunas and Knight... And I'm still good with getting Knight.
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  31. #71
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    Isn't saying someone has a lot of room to improve, just a polite way of saying they suck right now?

  32. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deleterious View Post
    Isn't saying someone has a lot of room to improve, just a polite way of saying they suck right now?
    Not necessarily.

    It could also mean they've shown flashes of talent, have lots of talent, but are too young to realize that talent just yet. And Knight didn't suck last year. He showed good 3-pt range, improved his game during his 1st year in college (specifically his assist-to-TO ratio from 1-1 to 1.5-to-1), and showed he was a leader for his team.

    Where does "suck" fit in there?
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    Quote Originally Posted by 84 Lives!!! View Post
    Not necessarily.

    It could also mean they've shown flashes of talent, have lots of talent, but are too young to realize that talent just yet. And Knight didn't suck last year. He showed good 3-pt range, improved his game during his 1st year in college (specifically his assist-to-TO ratio from 1-1 to 1.5-to-1), and showed he was a leader for his team.

    Where does "suck" fit in there?
    1.5:1 is sucking. Especially when the assist per game is only 4.3 per game. It would be different if this was John Wall dropping 8 or 9 assists per game. But its 4.3 per game...

  34. #74
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    Some players suck and have upside and some suck without much upside. I personally don't see Knight having a lot of upside and I am trying to convince my some otherwise. I do know that a lot of basketball people who live, eat, and breath the game feel like Knight at least has a chance to be a solid player. And that at least gives me some hope.

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    People are being a bit hard on Knight over his freshman season. Kemba Walker scored like 8 points a game his freshman year. Knight was the PG, the leader and the best player on a major college team that won its conference tourney and made the elite 8. Plus they were a point away from winning that elite 8 game. Knight was always the guy who stepped up in the biggest moments and the biggest games. He's going to be a guy you want to have the ball in his hands at the end of games IMO, with his shot making ability and basketball IQ.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hart View Post
    When you compare him to NBA level point guards in ball handling, I think he needs a lot of improvement. He is not going to be able to attack the rim in traffic in the NBA. But that is as much because of his lack of explosiveness as it is his ball handling. I do think his ball handling will be sufficient enough at some point for him to get in the lane and create for himself or his teammates. He is just going to have to be very smart and creative.
    This.

    Knight will have to work hard to become an NBA PG, as it isn't his natural position. His A:TO ratio was only 1.3:1, and I agree with your evaluation of both his quickness off the dribble and ball handling.

    I like the fact that he plays defense and that he carried that Kentucky team at times as a Frosh. Knight was a value at the 8th spot, but he wasn't the player I wanted. Perhaps Dumars sees a little of himself in this kid, and really, it is hard not to in certain ways. I just hope the pick works out, and we can acquire a quality veteran big in either a trade or as a FA.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nastradamus View Post
    People are being a bit hard on Knight over his freshman season. Kemba Walker scored like 8 points a game his freshman year. Knight was the PG, the leader and the best player on a major college team that won its conference tourney and made the elite 8. Plus they were a point away from winning that elite 8 game. Knight was always the guy who stepped up in the biggest moments and the biggest games. He's going to be a guy you want to have the ball in his hands at the end of games IMO, with his shot making ability and basketball IQ.
    Kemba was behind one of the best PGs in the conference as a frosh—that's what usually happens when you go to a top-five basketball school, even if you are a five-star recruit like he was.

    Knight was very good as a frosh last year, but Kemba willed a under-manned UConn team to the NCAA Title. If you put Knight on UConn, and Kemba on Kentucky, would each player have done similar things? You can make a very good argument that Kentucky had better complementary pieces than UConn.

    I liked Walker better with this pick, but I understand drafting Knight. Dumars wants to use Stuckey and Knight to lock down opposing backcourts, and that isn't a bad place to start. If we can get a quality big man to start alongside Monroe, we'll be in business.

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    Nastradamus is offline MotownSports Fan
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    That's kind of the point though. A lot of guys aren't even playing significant minutes their freshman year, Knight was taking his team to the elite 8 as its lead player and the guy with the ball at the end of games. I don't know if UConn wins with Knight or not(it was a one point game between their teams though), but I like Knight as a junior's chances at that a lot better.

    I'm just not sold on Walker 100%. I like bigger guards than him, he's not a natural passer/playmaker, he needs to improve his 3 point shooting and he supposedly has question marks on his knees.

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    I think the Cavs were nuts to let him pass at #4...I think Knight's a safer bet to be a high end player than any of the bigs they had to choose from. Even if he wound up as a 3rd guard getting minutes at PG and SG, I still think he has more value down the line than Tristan Thompson...

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    Quote Originally Posted by mickeyb105 View Post
    Dumars wants to use Stuckey and Knight to lock down opposing backcourts, and that isn't a bad place to start.
    Wouldn't that require Stuckey to be a good defender? The only thing he's ever locked down is the ball.
    Matt Millen never left Detroit - he just started wearing a very convincing Joe Dumars costume.

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