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  1. #1
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    Default Game 51: Kings Vs Pistons - 2/10/10




    17-34 (Road: 4-22) @ 18-32 (Home: 12-14)

    Live from the Palace of Auburn Hills



    Game Info: 7:30 pm EST Wed Feb 10, 2010

    TV:

    Injury Report:

    Detroit: None

    Sacramento: Francisco Garcia - Out (Wrist).

    Standings

    6 games behind 8th seed.
    7th in draft lottery (4.3% chance of #1 pick).

    Team Stats



    Team Four Factors

    eFG% .494 (17th of 30)
    TOV% .141 (21st of 30)
    ORB% .290 (3rd of 30)
    FT/FGA .220 (20th of 30)

    Team Leaders

    Win Shares Tyreke Evans 3.9
    Minutes Per Game Tyreke Evans 36.9
    Points Per Game Tyreke Evans 20.5
    Rebounds Per Game Jason Thompson 8.7
    Assists Per Game Tyreke Evans 5.1
    Steals Per Game Tyreke Evans 1.5
    Blocks Per Game Spencer Hawes 1.0



    Team Four Factors

    eFG% .459 (29th of 30)
    TOV% .131 (10th of 30)
    ORB% .310 (2nd of 30)
    FT/FGA .221 (19th of 30)

    Team Leaders

    Win Shares Ben Wallace 3.9
    Minutes Per Game Rodney Stuckey 36.2
    Points Per Game Rodney Stuckey 17.8
    Rebounds Per Game Ben Wallace 9.0
    Assists Per Game Rodney Stuckey 4.7
    Steals Per Game Rodney Stuckey 1.4
    Blocks Per Game Ben Wallace 1.2

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    Both teams played out of town games last night. I'm sure the airports were a mess last night in the area. Should be interesting to see when each team got in.

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    Is it me, or is Stuckey developing a better game lately?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buddha View Post
    Is it me, or is Stuckey developing a better game lately?
    I haven't been watching the games, but in the boxscores it seems like he's been getting more assists.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buddha View Post
    Is it me, or is Stuckey developing a better game lately?
    He is distributing the ball a bit more.

    I think he had 12 assists in a game a couple nights ago. I remember he had more assists than the team had in the previous game combined.

    I had the game on last night, but I'll have to admit I was working on my soccer game. I'm getting close to trying out my second venture - a 2009 MLS set. I want to get it done before the season actually starts, so the game was on with my back to the TV for most of the game.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DTroppens View Post
    He is distributing the ball a bit more.

    I think he had 12 assists in a game a couple nights ago. I remember he had more assists than the team had in the previous game combined.

    I had the game on last night, but I'll have to admit I was working on my soccer game. I'm getting close to trying out my second venture - a 2009 MLS set. I want to get it done before the season actually starts, so the game was on with my back to the TV for most of the game.
    Look at you, Mr. Soccer all of a sudden.

    It would be good to get any game out before the world cup starts. Or at least have it out when the World Cup is on. That's when you'll get the most interest in the biggest market in the world.
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    His overall stats are trending down the past 10 games compared to his season averages. The one stat that is up is indeed his assists. Good to see.

    Now if we could fix his atrocious shooting. Shooting 14% from behind the line wont cut it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deleterious View Post
    His overall stats are trending down the past 10 games compared to his season averages. The one stat that is up is indeed his assists. Good to see.

    Now if we could fix his atrocious shooting. Shooting 14% from behind the line wont cut it.
    Stuckey is likely a player who deficiencies will be easier to exploit as years go on..With the new SABR style Morey analytics, teams break down where you like to shoot from and where you make shots from..they either subtly push you to your least efficient areas, or deny you the ball in your most efficent areas..When you shoot 40% and can be made even less efficient than that, plus you take a high quantitiy of shots..it's not a prescription for victory.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sportz4life View Post
    Stuckey is likely a player who deficiencies will be easier to exploit as years go on..With the new SABR style Morey analytics, teams break down where you like to shoot from and where you make shots from..they either subtly push you to your least efficient areas, or deny you the ball in your most efficent areas..When you shoot 40% and can be made even less efficient than that, plus you take a high quantitiy of shots..it's not a prescription for victory.
    They will become even more glaring come playoff time. When teams have time to implement and practice a game plan. Instead of just playing last night, maybe hear some stuff about tonights opponent at a walk through, then play the game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deleterious View Post
    His overall stats are trending down the past 10 games compared to his season averages. The one stat that is up is indeed his assists. Good to see.

    Now if we could fix his atrocious shooting. Shooting 14% from behind the line wont cut it.
    I don't he can shoot 30% from 3, at least not with any volume.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buddha View Post
    Look at you, Mr. Soccer all of a sudden.

    It would be good to get any game out before the world cup starts. Or at least have it out when the World Cup is on. That's when you'll get the most interest in the biggest market in the world.
    Sold about 25 of the EPL game, most to people in Italy and Europe. I think the exact total was 23, so I am a "hundredare" when it comes to being a soccer sports game designer. The MLS was a bit more difficult because I couldn't find passing stats and defensive stats. I had to go with more team stats and adjust individually for those I was able to find earned postseason honors for their defensive ability, or are known as strong passers. Of course, assists helped with passers. UEFA Champions League is what I'll be working on next - getting those teams that were eliminated from the group stage done.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DTroppens View Post
    Sold about 25 of the EPL game, most to people in Italy and Europe. I think the exact total was 23, so I am a "hundredare" when it comes to being a soccer sports game designer. The MLS was a bit more difficult because I couldn't find passing stats and defensive stats. I had to go with more team stats and adjust individually for those I was able to find earned postseason honors for their defensive ability, or are known as strong passers. Of course, assists helped with passers. UEFA Champions League is what I'll be working on next - getting those teams that were eliminated from the group stage done.
    Are you using real players and real leagues? If so, I imagine you might be getting a C & D letter soon...

    Just some helpful advice.
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    Quote Originally Posted by sportz4life View Post
    Stuckey is likely a player who deficiencies will be easier to exploit as years go on..With the new SABR style Morey analytics, teams break down where you like to shoot from and where you make shots from..they either subtly push you to your least efficient areas, or deny you the ball in your most efficent areas..When you shoot 40% and can be made even less efficient than that, plus you take a high quantitiy of shots..it's not a prescription for victory.
    I think Stuckey's shooting woes have more to do with the fact that he can't shoot rather than teams subtly pushing him anywhere or any SABR style defenses (as if putting players in positions they don't like to be in was something invented by Darryl Morey).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deleterious View Post
    They will become even more glaring come playoff time. When teams have time to implement and practice a game plan. Instead of just playing last night, maybe hear some stuff about tonights opponent at a walk through, then play the game.
    This is more likely. No one can really "prepare" for a team during the regular season with great detail. Even if you start understanding tendencies, you may have just come in from someplace the night before and don't even really get a chance to go in detail about X or Y player - at least not to the point of great reinforcement.

    Heck, look at Flip's offense. It looked pretty awesome during the regular season frequently. The Pistons were going to win titles because of their offense instead of their defense. But it was apparent once the playoffs came and teams were able to concentrate on the team's tendencies for 10-14 days for 4-7 games, that was going to be an issue. In the playoffs you start with a base, and expand on that knowledge with each game. You learn even the most slight tendencies of a player more and more and can implement things for it. Heck, as fans we get more knowledgeable about an opponent after seeing them 2-3-4-5 to 7 games in a row just watching the games and talking on this MB about what we've seen. During a regular season like this (when the team is bad) I hardly remember much about any opponent because I know I'm not seeing Atlanta in the playoffs anytime soon.

    I'm guessing players go by more of what they've picked up over the years during the regular season than some great scheme that was devised just for a game on Feb. 10.

    Generally about Stuckey's shooting though - I just don't think he's that great a shooter. In fact, I think in a playoff scenario you'd see people encouraging him to take jumpers, daring him to do so from just about anywhere on the floor and just prepare to pack on him defensively if he drives.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buddha View Post
    I think Stuckey's shooting woes have more to do with the fact that he can't shoot rather than teams subtly pushing him anywhere or any SABR style defenses (as if putting players in positions they don't like to be in was something invented by Darryl Morey).

    Doubt it..he like every single athlete has sweet spots on the floor..in fact I'll guarantee it. Professional athlete's profeciency levels are so far beyond how mortals play games, normal people cannot comprehend their proficiency levels.

    Rodney Stuckey shoots hundreds of jumpers every single day..

    Believe what you want..Not really worth discussing this type of info with someone who is already so vastly superior to me in knowledge..

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    Quote Originally Posted by DTroppens View Post

    Generally about Stuckey's shooting though - I just don't think he's that great a shooter.
    Oh no. Don't you know? It's because Darryl Morey revolutionized how teams play defense.

    I mean come on, he shoots hundreds of jumpers a day, that will make anyone a good NBA shooter. Ask Sportz.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buddha View Post
    Is it me, or is Stuckey developing a better game lately?
    He's been getting more assists but I think that is relative to the players he's got to pass to now as opposed to when he was the only scorer on the team.
    He has also been pulling up a bit more rather then bullrushing to the basket, still not passing much out of the drive to the lane though.

  18. #18
    DrWho17 is online now MotownSports Fan
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    Stuckey's jumper has improved this year, he's changed his form quite a bit this year still a work in progress, one thing players in the NBA can do is improve their shot. The 3-pt percentage doesn't really mean much, he doesn't shoot them unless he's under shot clock pressure most of the time, rarely takes them otherwise.
    Last edited by DrWho17; 02-10-2010 at 06:28 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrWho17 View Post
    Stuckey's jumper has improved this year, he's changed his form quite a bit this year still a work in progress, one thing players in the NBA can do is improve their shot. The 3-pt percentage doesn't really mean much, he doesn't shoot them unless he's under shot clock pressure most of the time, rarely takes them otherwise.
    It's improved how exactly? His eFG% is 5% lower than last year. Not sure that is any type of improvement.

    I disagree the three point percentage doesn't mean anything. I posted a blog post in here at the start of the season talking about the teams with better 3 point shooting PG's had a much better offense then teams who don't. Guess what teams offense is in the bottom 5 of the league? If he is going to continue putting up those awful numbers, he better start doing everything else really well. Like Rondo. He is just as bad as Stuckey behind the line, but he can run a team, play defense, etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrWho17 View Post
    He's been getting more assists but I think that is relative to the players he's got to pass to now as opposed to when he was the only scorer on the team.
    This is what initially came to mind for me as well. A lot of this team's PG assist numbers for the last few years simply have to do with how well Rip (and sometimes Tay) is shooting it off the 1st option on the curl, rather than how well the PG is making things happen on the court.
    Matt Millen never left Detroit - he just started wearing a very convincing Joe Dumars costume.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Betrayer View Post
    This is what initially came to mind for me as well. A lot of this team's PG assist numbers for the last few years simply have to do with how well Rip (and sometimes Tay) is shooting it off the 1st option on the curl, rather than how well the PG is making things happen on the court.
    The Pistons offense certainly doesn't lead to high assist rates, no easy fast break assist, not a lot of possessions either relative to other teams other, slow pace and all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrWho17 View Post
    The Pistons offense certainly doesn't lead to high assist rates, no easy fast break assist, not a lot of possessions either relative to other teams other, slow pace and all.
    Yeah, what happened to Stuckey's "I'm running and they better come with me" talk?

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    Since I'm snowed in, I figured I'd watch some of this game. The only stream I found's audio is so off!
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    I would like to see Rip play well tonight. He is missing a lot of open jumpers lately that he use to make.

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    Back to back steals to dunks from Hamilton and Stuckey. Nice to see after the slow start.
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    Quote Originally Posted by sportz4life View Post
    Doubt it..he like every single athlete has sweet spots on the floor..in fact I'll guarantee it. Professional athlete's profeciency levels are so far beyond how mortals play games, normal people cannot comprehend their proficiency levels.

    Rodney Stuckey shoots hundreds of jumpers every single day..

    Believe what you want..Not really worth discussing this type of info with someone who is already so vastly superior to me in knowledge..
    I would like to know where Stuckey's sweet spot is because I don't see one when I watch him play. Are we talking shots outside of 8-10 feet because it doesn't look like he shoots anything beyond that well to me? If he does have one, is there a big enough sample size to actually call it a sweet spot?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hart View Post
    I would like to know where Stuckey's sweet spot is because I don't see one when I watch him play. Are we talking shots outside of 8-10 feet because it doesn't look like he shoots anything beyond that well to me? If he does have one, is there a big enough sample size to actually call it a sweet spot?
    He has one, when you take 1300 shots in a season...your best spots on the floor are pretty easy to identify..

    go click on a shot chart at the end of a game it will surprise you where players made baskets are from.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sportz4life View Post
    He has one, when you take 1300 shots in a season...your best spots on the floor are pretty easy to identify..

    go click on a shot chart at the end of a game it will surprise you where players made baskets are from.
    But do they have a shot chart for a full season or career?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hart View Post
    But do they have a shot chart for a full season or career?
    yes..plus teams compile data a little different than websites..

    The way teams advance scout they have every shot each player takes from every spot on the floor and the type of offensive set it came from..some teams have no incorporated how closely they were guarded whether it was off the bounce or catch and shoot..etc..

    ask Buddha, he knows these things..

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScrubBeaterUpper View Post
    Yeah, what happened to Stuckey's "I'm running and they better come with me" talk?
    I personally think Stuckey has stamina problems, lots of his wild shots are toward the end of a time on the floor. As a side note the last couple of games the Pistons have pushed the tempo a little bit, Prince specifically seems to be running out hard and trying to push the pace.

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    I'd be happy if Hamilton never shot another 3.
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    Quote Originally Posted by drownwithyou View Post
    I'd be happy if Hamilton never shot another 3.
    He used to be a decent spot up three point shooter but he can't buy a basket the last few games...three pointer or otherwise.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrWho17 View Post
    I personally think Stuckey has stamina problems, lots of his wild shots are toward the end of a time on the floor. As a side note the last couple of games the Pistons have pushed the tempo a little bit, Prince specifically seems to be running out hard and trying to push the pace.
    I would hope Tayshaun has fresh legs given all that time he has missed this year. I honestly didn't think Tayshaun would have any trade value left outside of his expiring contract but he has played well enough lately to make me believe he can help another team out on the floor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buddha View Post
    Are you using real players and real leagues? If so, I imagine you might be getting a C & D letter soon...

    Just some helpful advice.
    It's so under the radar, I think I'm pretty safe.
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    Quote Originally Posted by sportz4life View Post
    yes..plus teams compile data a little different than websites..

    The way teams advance scout they have every shot each player takes from every spot on the floor and the type of offensive set it came from..some teams have no incorporated how closely they were guarded whether it was off the bounce or catch and shoot..etc..

    ask Buddha, he knows these things..
    I do. And unlike other people, I actually understand them rather than just regurgitating a shallow understanding of things in order to rip the general manager of the home team...

    But please, you go ahead and lecture all of us on basketball statistics. It's very informative.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DTroppens View Post
    This is more likely. No one can really "prepare" for a team during the regular season with great detail. Even if you start understanding tendencies, you may have just come in from someplace the night before and don't even really get a chance to go in detail about X or Y player - at least not to the point of great reinforcement.

    Heck, look at Flip's offense. It looked pretty awesome during the regular season frequently. The Pistons were going to win titles because of their offense instead of their defense. But it was apparent once the playoffs came and teams were able to concentrate on the team's tendencies for 10-14 days for 4-7 games, that was going to be an issue. In the playoffs you start with a base, and expand on that knowledge with each game. You learn even the most slight tendencies of a player more and more and can implement things for it. Heck, as fans we get more knowledgeable about an opponent after seeing them 2-3-4-5 to 7 games in a row just watching the games and talking on this MB about what we've seen. During a regular season like this (when the team is bad) I hardly remember much about any opponent because I know I'm not seeing Atlanta in the playoffs anytime soon.

    I'm guessing players go by more of what they've picked up over the years during the regular season than some great scheme that was devised just for a game on Feb. 10.

    Generally about Stuckey's shooting though - I just don't think he's that great a shooter. In fact, I think in a playoff scenario you'd see people encouraging him to take jumpers, daring him to do so from just about anywhere on the floor and just prepare to pack on him defensively if he drives.
    Often they have all the same data, it's more difficult to practive it on short notice or often they don't want to show it, todeter teams from preparing and practicing counters..

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    Quote Originally Posted by DTroppens View Post
    It's so under the radar, I think I'm pretty safe.
    Ok. But watch yourself. You could be out a lot of money for violating those kinds of things. If you have any questions, you can PM me.
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    Why doesn't stuckey dunk more?
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    Quote Originally Posted by sportz4life View Post
    Stuckey is likely a player who deficiencies will be easier to exploit as years go on..With the new SABR style Morey analytics, teams break down where you like to shoot from and where you make shots from..they either subtly push you to your least efficient areas, or deny you the ball in your most efficent areas..When you shoot 40% and can be made even less efficient than that, plus you take a high quantitiy of shots..it's not a prescription for victory.
    A player's offense isn't necessarily static from season to season though. They figure out what's being taken away and add something to their game to offset that. Having said that, I would guess his shooting % is down (apart from injuries and his increased offensive role) because teams are daring him to shoot/taking away his drive as opposed to taking away his favorite jump-shot spots.

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    Tayshaun playing well. Hey NBA, anybody want him?
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