Brandon Inge

[belcherboy]

What are your thoughts on him? He went from hitting a bomb today to leaving 8 runners stranded and giving up an error that pretty much cost us the game. I love the kid, but the guy doesn't hit and seems to struggle under pressure.

Unless he has a great playoff series, should we consider an upgrade at 3rd??

What do you think? Am I being to hard on the kid?

[jackson_cannery]

He's not supposed to be our best hitter. He hits .250 with power from the 9-spot and turns doubles into outs every other night.

Everybody makes errors. Inge stays.

[T.O. Tiger Fan]

He bats ninth and has 27 HRS and over 80 RBI's - good production from the bottom of the order. Yes he makes defensive lapses, but he also gets to balls other 3B cannot.

I think they need to upgrade corner OF and 1B much before they need to upgrade 3B.

[Yoda]

I don't think any player on the team is above being upgraded. I think he's lower on the list than a couple others though. Today's game shouldn't influence that any.

[Domino]

I think he gets one more year and if he doesn't bring his average up a little (like .20 points) and make less errors, we start looking for a replacement.

[dt35456884]

I don't think any player on the team is above being upgraded. I think he's lower on the list than a couple others though. Today's game shouldn't influence that any.

What he said.

[berneree]

Since Aramis Ramirez is likely to be available as a Free Agent....to me it is a no-brainer. Offer Aramis a 5 yr/$75 million deal and put Inge as a utility guy.

[mc_madness]

Curtis Granderson concerns me more. He looked lost at the plate in a critical AB today.

Way, way too many K's from a leadoff man.

[Moonlight Graham]

What are your thoughts on him?
1st and 2nd 1 out, any high hopper, please just tag the lead runner. Thats all I ask.

[tigerkid23]

Curtis Granderson concerns me more. He looked lost at the plate in a critical AB today.

Way, way too many K's from a leadoff man.

Curtis didn't have the luxury of being able to fly out and drive in a run though. And he's being forced into the leadoff spot. He's been a middle-of-the-order hitter throughout his career.

[OldTimey]

Today's game was a great example of what drives me nuts about him. He'll make spectacular plays all season long then have mental lapses on routine ones. He wasn't single handedly responsible for us losign the clinching game. However, he was one of the bigger reasons.

That said he deserves the gold glove.

[jctigerfan1968]

I think you have to look at the Big Picture. Brandon have done fantastic. However he does strike out alot. However, Our biggest issues are addressing our need at 1st base and an outfielder, making Maggs a DH. Of the 2 new players we need a BIG BAT. Like a Soraino, Carlos Lee someone like that. Also we need to upgrade our speed and reduce our strikeouts. So Inge is not above being replaced if the right situation came around but we have other more immediate areas we need to upgrade.

[FloridaTigers]

I knew there'd be a topic on this. Heck no. Keep Inge. Is he one of the better defensive third basemen. Its not his fault we lost. It was Bonderman, Zumaya, and Rodney. They're why we lost. He did his part, he hit a homerun. He shouldn't have been in any of those other situations. Keep Inge.

[pyrotigers]

We should upgrade our offense, regardless of what position.

I would put third base fourth on the list after:

First Base - Left Field - Right Field/DH (Whichever Maggs isn't at)

So in other words he should be back next year unless a great third basemen falls into our laps.

[Domino]

I knew there'd be a topic on this. Heck no. Keep Inge. Is he one of the better defensive third basemen. Its not his fault we lost. It was Bonderman, Zumaya, and Rodney. They're why we lost. He did his part, he hit a homerun. He shouldn't have been in any of those other situations. Keep Inge.

Disagree with you on the reason we lost.... to me that blame falls squarely on Inge an Rodney especially.

[ian_a]

Can't rely on Inge to make routine plays, offensively or defensively. He'll throw away easy outs. He'll K when they need a sac fly. I say replace him.

[Yoda]

Its not his fault we lost. It was Bonderman, Zumaya, and Rodney. They're why we lost.

What the heck did Zumaya do?

2.1, 1 hit, 0 runs, 0 earned runs, 1 BB, 1K.

[HeyAbbott]

We have bigger fish to fry than Brandon Inge. We really need a reliable left handed bat an Casey is not the answer at first base.

[monkeynuts]

He bats ninth and has 27 HRS and over 80 RBI's - good production from the bottom of the order. Yes he makes defensive lapses, but he also gets to balls other 3B cannot.

I think they need to upgrade corner OF and 1B much before they need to upgrade 3B.

I'm sorry, but I hate that argument. Yes, he's a good ninth hitter, but your 3B should not be your ninth hitter.

[Shaggy Ry]

We need to upgrade 1B, 3B and LF - tradionally the meat of ones batting order, and we're offering up arguable our three weakest hitters. We're lucky that Pudge and Guillen are above average for their positions, off-setting to a degree the levels of sucktitude we field at the aformentioned positions.

[illmatic774]

He is what he is. I wouldnt mind if the team was to go fishing for a great 3rd baseman. Inge wouldnt have to necessarily leave.

[Casimir]

He wasn't single handedly responsible for us losign the clinching game. However, he was one of the bigger reasons.

He had a rough game, blowing some situations later in the game.

(Not directed specifically at OT, but in general to those who want Inge ran out of town after today): Oh yeah, by the way, he also hit a 2 run HR that helped establish a 5 run lead early in the game. Funny how that's been missed, eh?

[Anthony]

I hate him. That being said, unless its a huge upgrade at thrid, no reason to pitch him.

[tigersfandm]

MANY other teams would love to have inge as their 3B. We better not get rid of him or have him move to another role.

[belcherboy]

He had a rough game, blowing some situations later in the game.

(Not directed specifically at OT, but in general to those who want Inge ran out of town after today): Oh yeah, by the way, he also hit a 2 run HR that helped establish a 5 run lead early in the game. Funny how that's been missed, eh?

from the original post: He went from hitting a bomb today to leaving 8 runners stranded and giving up an error that pretty much cost us the game.

I really do like the kid, but he seems like he is going to be a career 9th hitter. That doesn't seem like a good option for a 3rd baseman. His big draw for starting with the Tigers was his defense and he has made some mistakes here down the stretch defensively. If he can't hit and struggles in tight spots defensively, would it be worth a look getting a new guy. We might even be able to trade him this off season as he would certainly get the interest of more than a few teams IMO.

Overall, I won't complain if we keep him, but I think it wouldn't be hard to upgrade his position.

[Casimir]

from the original post:

Sorry, should've qualified it as "few" instead of "no one".

[jadefalcon]

Inge is a little punk that is occaisionaly overrated because he hits home runs and makes spectacular plays at 3B (I have been guily of overvaluing him as well). Your third baseman can't be your ninth hitter. He has to be a middle of the order guy that can drive in runs consistently. He also has to get on base better than a .315 clip. And Brandon has way too many errors late in the game when the game is on the line.

[Casimir]

Your third baseman can't be your ninth hitter. He has to be a middle of the order guy that can drive in runs consistently.

Faulty logic. You need 9 guys in the lineup to produce throughout the lineup regardless of where they play defensively.

[belcherboy]

Faulty logic. You need 9 guys in the lineup to produce throughout the lineup regardless of where they play defensively.

I agree, but this team needs a big stick. It is common for a big stick to come from your 3rd baseman. If we had another big stick in our lineup, than our complaints about Inge would be moot. He has certainly given us great power fo r a guy that is primarily late in the lineup. I'm just concerned that he isn't going to become a clutch player. He is excellent defensively, but seems to make blunders when we least can afford it. He has hit some bombs, but rarely is seen on base, strikes out often, and doesn't seem to be able to move runners with consistancy. Of course, I hate to criticize someone right after a poor outing. It usually is an unfair assessment.

[Casimir]

He is excellent defensively, but seems to make blunders when we least can afford it..... Of course, I hate to criticize someone right after a poor outing. It usually is an unfair assessment.

I'd be happy to see how many runs Inge has prevented in close & late situations vs all other situations. I'd be willing to bet the numerals are probably similar.

[tater6]

I also think every position could be upgraded. Maybe 3b is not their biggest need, it 's high on the list. Inge's greatest asset to this team is still "supersub".

[ErieTigerFan]

I agree, but this team needs a big stick. It is common for a big stick to come from your 3rd baseman. If we had another big stick in our lineup, than our complaints about Inge would be moot. He has certainly given us great power fo r a guy that is primarily late in the lineup. I'm just concerned that he isn't going to become a clutch player. He is excellent defensively, but seems to make blunders when we least can afford it. He has hit some bombs, but rarely is seen on base, strikes out often, and doesn't seem to be able to move runners with consistancy. Of course, I hate to criticize someone right after a poor outing. It usually is an unfair assessment.

Then I would suggest the "big stick" we go after this off-season be a name like Miguel Tejada or Soriano. Inge does too many things of value to just merely discard.

[Jo3y]

You people that want to discard Inge are crazy. I have freinds that are fans of other teams and they all would love to have Inge. The only people that dont like Inge are from Detroit. Strange

[Johnny Mac]

he is terrible and needs to be upgraded

that being said, i wouldnt put anyone on our current team at 3rd ahead of him, if we cant get anyone in the offseason, id leave him there

[Johnny Mac]

You people that want to discard Inge are crazy. I have freinds that are fans of other teams and they all would love to have Inge. The only people that dont like Inge are from Detroit. Strange

that is just a plain lie

i am here in florida and people's here view is he isnt good offensively or defensively. they think pudge and maggs and guillen are our only good offensive players.

[Johnny Mac]

You need 9 guys in the lineup to produce throughout the lineup regardless of where they play defensively.

by produce, you mean not leaving 8 guys on base in your most important game right?

[columbus tiger]

Other than today and the leaving 8 runners argument, you people bashing Inge are doing so by saying "Our 3b shouldn't be in the 9th spot" insinuating that he is a terrible hitter. He hit 27 freakin' homeruns! In the 9th spot! Put him 6th and I am sure that would be higher and so would the RBI's. His failures were definately not from his inability to hold up to the scrutiny of "being a third baseman". Find another dog to kick.

Sometimes it seems people lose sight of how tough it is to play baseball and that it should be easy as pie to just plug someone in who can hit .300, 25 HR, 100 RBI and play great defense. I am sorry to say that those guys just don't grow on trees. Inge has been improving and this might be a career year for him, but he certainly deserves AT LEAST another year to see if this is his new level or a fluke or if maybe, just maybe he gets even better.

I would take Inge on my team AS MY 3B anyday.

[Anthony]

You people that want to discard Inge are crazy. I have freinds that are fans of other teams and they all would love to have Inge. The only people that dont like Inge are from Detroit. Strange

Well if they happen to be the GM of any team, we'll (me and a few others) gladly take back talent for a few pretty plays here and there.

[Mike E Monster]

It's not being hard on anyone to say that Brandon Inge messed the bed in the biggest game of the year, so far. He talks the talk, but does not walk the walk - he throws out brash quotes like a veteran who has been through wars and deserves slack, when in fact, he is nothing more than a cocky, average Major Leaguer who is vastly overvalued. I mean, I don't know about you, but I really coudn't care less as to how far he can hit a golf ball. Not being able to even make contact to win your team a division, well, that's another story. He wears the goat horns today, no doubt - with an honorable mention to Bonderman who couldn't even give us six innings with a 6-0 lead. Both would make for interesting trade bait, depending on what we get back in return. Do we want a team of "good guys" or do we want a team of winners? Both of these individuals leave me suspect of their ability to come through when it counts . . . we'll see what the playoffs have in store for these two tenured-Tigers.

[Johnny Mac]

Im willing to let Inge try to prove himself in the playoffs

I was on the fence with him, today just pushed me far to the hes worthless side of the fence, i probably overreacted a little bit too

If he produces in the playoffs, in my mind, i guess id be right back on the fence with him

he is a fringe starter in my oppinion, who could definatly be upgraded

[Ingefanclub]

Inge just missed a grandslam in the 11th before striking out. He hit a shot that just curved foul. Once that ball landed foul he had a couple strikes on him and he was in the hole. I was just praying that he wouldn't hit into a double play then.

The error was tough. He thought about whether he had time to make the double play or tagging 3rd base it seemed....then he knew he didn't have much time to react so on his way down from his leap he gunned the ball to 2nd but his feet weren't set and the ball it sailed ito RF. If I were him I would have tagged 3rd base as I didn't think there was time for a DP but the runner stopped running between 2nd and 3rd.

[djhutch]

You have to get that run in from 3B with less than 2 out. Have to.

[mcqfesijiba]

Man, people are going overboard on this. Inge's error did indeed come at a very bad time, but this was a TEAM EFFORT. To blame Inge solely for the loss and do all but blindfold him and put him in front of the firing squad is ridiculous. I don't post very often at all on this board, but I had to seeing how fickle fans can be around here. Personally, Inge has been everything I've expected of him this year and maybe more. I think he's a solid player, but that's just it. If our hopes are riding on a player who is generally supposed to be our #9 hitter, then we're in trouble. We simply aren't the Yankees where the #9 hitter Cano is a batting title contender.

Remember, this is a team effort, so don't single anybody out. Maybe Bonderman, Zumaya, Rodney, or Rogers should have pitched better? Maybe if Leyland wouldn't have given an out away by pinch hitting Neifi Perez, a rally would have started? Maybe we should go even deeper and say Dombrowski should have put better players on this team? The Tigers are what they are and they are still in the playoffs, even if they aren't going in on a high note.

[grandma g]

TEAM EFFORT....Lay off Inge...there are 8 other guys with him...Rodney STUNK! Everyone will have to play their best game in the playoffs & it will be a TEAM EFFORT!

[tigersfandm]

if people are nit picking at things, then here is another thing that many may have forgot. Why aren't the nit picking people bringing up the fact that Infante grounding into a double play earlier in the game with 1 out and bases loaded. Come on poeple, stop nit picking. win as a team, lose as a team. Inge is a solid 3B and I hope he is the 3B for a long time as a Tiger!

[OldTimey]

TEAM EFFORT....Lay off Inge...there are 8 other guys with him...Rodney STUNK! Everyone will have to play their best game in the playoffs & it will be a TEAM EFFORT!

No. I'll lay it on Inge. He was terrible yesterday. He didn't execute in two key, routine situations that helped contribute to the loss in a big way. In addition Rodney and Bonderman were terrible. But Inge blew two chances to help out. It was painful to see. Was the loss Inge's fault? No. Was it more his fault than Carlos Guillen or Magglio? Absolutely.

[grandma g]

We are PROUD of ALL the Tigers, this has been the greatest season....we get a little taste of what is to come in the next years...get behind the guys, IT IS RALLY TIME.....

[OldTimey]

if people are nit picking at things, then here is another thing that many may have forgot. Why aren't the nit picking people bringing up the fact that Infante grounding into a double play earlier in the game with 1 out and bases loaded. Come on poeple, stop nit picking. win as a team, lose as a team. Inge is a solid 3B and I hope he is the 3B for a long time as a Tiger!

He has been excellent defensively this year and probably deserves the Gold Glove. He hits for decent power. But overall is a very average player. If we can upgrade he is one of the places we need to. Not as much as first and outfield. But 3B is definitely 3rd on the list.

[OldTimey]

We are PROUD of ALL the Tigers, this has been the greatest season....we get a little taste of what is to come in the next years...get behind the guys, IT IS RALLY TIME.....

Thanks for the blind faith lecture.

[estrepe1]

No. I'll lay it on Inge. He was terrible yesterday. He didn't execute in two key, routine situations that helped contribute to the loss in a big way. In addition Rodney and Bonderman were terrible. But Inge blew two chances to help out. It was painful to see. Was the loss Inge's fault? No. Was it more his fault than Carlos Guillen or Magglio? Absolutely.

This is true. Despite what people may think sometimes certain parts of the team don't perform.

I was upset with Granderson yesterday too... Even though that strike 3 call was a bad one....

We are PROUD of ALL the Tigers, this has been the greatest season....we get a little taste of what is to come in the next years...get behind the guys, IT IS RALLY TIME.....

That doesn't change the fact that certain players are more important to a team than others. Yesterday Inge let the team down in those two situations. I hope it doesn't happen again.

He has been excellent defensively this year and probably deserves the Gold Glove. He hits for decent power. But overall is a very average player.

He isn't the first player I would look to replace because I think there are a couple below average players in the lineup....

[billfer]

No. I'll lay it on Inge. He was terrible yesterday. He didn't execute in two key, routine situations that helped contribute to the loss in a big way. In addition Rodney and Bonderman were terrible. But Inge blew two chances to help out. It was painful to see. Was the loss Inge's fault? No. Was it more his fault than Carlos Guillen or Magglio? Absolutely.

I think that it's fair for Inge to take his share of the blame yesterday. He had a couple chances with the bat, and didn't make a couple plays with the glove. So he shares a large part in what happened yesterday, but a lesser part in the craptitude that was the weekend.

[84 Lives!!!]

Offseason Priorities, in order:

1. Resolve the 1st Base issue. Shelton might be a part of that solution... but I think is more of a part-timer at 1B than a 5-10 year solution at 1B. The resolution at 1B will depend on #2 and 3:

2. Trade a pitcher or two for a big bat. Pitchers in reverse order of expendability (higher desire by Detroit to hold onto them), and increasing order of interest from other teams: Miner, Maroth, Ledezma, Humberto, Jurrjens, Robertson, Bonderman. One of Robertson or Bonderman will probably be in a trade this offseason, IMO, plus at least one of the pitchers earlier in that list. Maroth has zero trade value at this point so he can be excluded. I would hope we can get who we want for Robertson, Humberto or Jurrjens, plus another prospect or MLB position player (Shelton or Monroe?). I would concentrate on a 1st baseman or corner OF'er... forget 3B, at least at this point.

3. Sign a big-bat FA like Soriano or Lee. Might depend on who we get in a trade. IE: If we somehow get Carl Crawford in a trade, I would look for a guy who can play 1st base... Carlos Lee? If we trade for a 1st baseman like Teixeira or Adam LaRoche (Braves) or Nick Johnson, then I'd look at Soriano first (to play LF), then Lee or someone else...

4. If we get Crawford and Carlos Lee (just for example), or Teixeira and Soriano (IE2), then Monroe could move to RF and Maggs could be the primary DH. I would then look to add a good LH'ed bat for an economical price: Matt Stairs? Someone better? How about Frank Catalanotto? He still has some position versatility I believe...

5. Give Inge one more year to see how much he can improve. I wouldn't worry about making a long-term assessment on him until after 2007... He's done enough this year to warrant more time (excellent power, .291 hitter after the All-Star game, excellent fielder... could improve some...).

That's my opinion.

[Ingefanclub]

You have to get that run in from 3B with less than 2 out. Have to.

I agree and was expecting Inge to come through. He just missed a grand slam..then he just missed on a screamer down the 3rd base line that landed inches foul. Once he had 2 strikes you have to worry...a fly ball scores the run but when you have 2 strikes it is much more difficult to hit the ball in the air.

With a man on 3rd and less than 2 outs the chances of a run scoring must be about 35-40% so it isn't a given.

[OldTimey]

Inge is not as young as people think (29, 30 next year) and this is very likely his career year.

[qsilvr2531]

I think I said the exact same thing last year though. And probably the year before as well.

[IdahoBert]

I think I said the exact same thing last year though. And probably the year before as well.Nice to see you back and congrats on the baby!

[84 Lives!!!]

Inge is not as young as people think (29, 30 next year) and this is very likely his career year.

I think he still has room for improvement. Not major improvement...

...but small improvements in consistency, both offensively and defensively, I believe are not beyond him even at this age.

[estrepe1]

Inge is not as young as people think (29, 30 next year) and this is very likely his career year.

Yep.

[Oblong]

Inge is not as young as people think (29, 30 next year) and this is very likely his career year.


This is a key point. Women like him because he's cute. Coach type fans like him because he's athletic. Moms like him because he reminds them of the lkid on the little league team who was smaller than the other kids, very active and ran around all the time. "Little Brandon" He's not some kid.

The proponents of Inge always told us that he was clutch. He wasn't clutch yesterday. Again I'll ask, what would you be saying if Infante or another player played 3B yesterday and had the same game? You'd be calling him a choker and wondering why Leyland didn't play Brandon.

[84 Lives!!!]

...But 3B is definitely 3rd on the list.

I think 4th.

1. 1st base
2. Corner OF'er
3. Versatile position player w/ above average LH'ed bat. Frank Catalanotto?
4. 3rd Base... in the 2007 offseason, not 2006.

Just my opinion.

[zachcadillac]

I think he gets one more year and if he doesn't bring his average up a little (like .20 points) and make less errors, we start looking for a replacement.

Inge's error total tells us absolutely nothing about his defensive value, which is immense.

[billfer]

Inge is not as young as people think (29, 30 next year) and this is very likely his career year.

This is probably true, but given his athleticism I think that he could also age gracefully. I wouldn't expect much improvement, but I also think he could sustain at his current level for quite some time.

[Johnny Mac]

He has been excellent defensively this year and probably deserves the Gold Glove.

He definatly does not even deserve to be a gold glove finalist. He makes some great plays, but he screws up a lot of easy ones. Just looks at his amount of errors(9th in baseball, and i think 3rd among 3B)

[zachcadillac]

Since Aramis Ramirez is likely to be available as a Free Agent....to me it is a no-brainer. Offer Aramis a 5 yr/$75 million deal and put Inge as a utility guy.

What a horrible idea. Ramirez is 30 and has already slipped a bit, offensively and defensively. Investing $75 million in him because he had three good months in a potential walk year is absurd.

The Tigers will most likely be paying Ordonez long after he's lost his usefulness; there's no need to dole out another contract that is sure to have the same unhappy ending.

[tiger337]

This is probably true, but given his athleticism I think that he could also age gracefully. I wouldn't expect much improvement, but I also think he could sustain at his current level for quite some time.

I agree with this. He won't get any better but I think his body type and athleticisim will allow him to have a longer peak. I don't see him going the way of Higginson and Young.

I think people are focusing too much on Inge. It's true he didn't come through yesterday but the Tigers lost the title because their pitching staff failed them all week long. Inge was very close to unforgettable moments on 2 occasions yesterday. This doesn't excuse the error but I thought he had won the game in both the 9th and 11th innings. He was inches from becoming a hero. That's the way it goes.

[djhutch]

Inge is not as young as people think (29, 30 next year) and this is very likely his career year.

He is what he is. I don't see him getting a lot better. If something else is out there, you have to upgrade.

[Truth]

What does Inge have to do with a club that held its destiny in its own hands and proceeded to be swept by the Royals? He didn't step up, neither did a lot of guys, including Bonderman who is supposed to have a much higher ceiling than Inge. He fell down, so did a lot of guys including Rogers who is supposed to be the veteran anchor of the rotation.

I think the Tigers will do some serious evaluation of where they are and what they need and I don't think Inge will be at the top of their concerns. They need a lead off hitter, a number 3 hitter, a 1B, a DH and a LF that doesn't go into multiple week slumps and check out mentally on too many plays.

And having said all of that...it was their strong suit, their pitching, that let them down the final weekend.

[GartenSpartan]

What a horrible idea. Ramirez is 30 and has already slipped a bit, offensively and defensively. Investing $75 million in him because he had three good months in a potential walk year is absurd.

The Tigers will most likely be paying Ordonez long after he's lost his usefulness; there's no need to dole out another contract that is sure to have the same unhappy ending.


Ramirez has actually been great in his last three years with the Cubs with an OPS over .900 each year including this year. He also just turned 28 in June. I would rather invest a large contract in him than a guy like Soriano or Carlos Lee if the Cubs do let him on the free agent market.

[Johnny Mac]

people are talking about trading a pitcher for a big bat

why not A-Rod, I HATE A-ROD, but he would be a good upgrade and the yankees may trade him after all the stuff going on this year

he isnt as expensive as you think either, the Rangers are still picking up $10 million a year of his contract

[laverty]

What does Inge have to do with a club that held its destiny in its own hands and proceeded to be swept by the Royals? He didn't step up, neither did a lot of guys, including Bonderman who is supposed to have a much higher ceiling than Inge. He fell down, so did a lot of guys including Rogers who is supposed to be the veteran anchor of the rotation.
And having said all of that...it was their strong suit, their pitching, that let them down the final weekend.
If Inge had executed in one or two situations in yesterday's game our perspective of the team and season/ last series wouldn't be at issue...:wink:

[zachcadillac]

Ramirez has actually been great in his last three years with the Cubs with an OPS over .900 each year including this year. He also just turned 28 in June. I would rather invest a large contract in him than a guy like Soriano or Carlos Lee if the Cubs do let him on the free agent market.

Well, I was most definitely mistaken about his age. I thought I had read somewhere on this board that his OPS has 25 points in each of the last three, but I could be wrong about that, too.

Either way, shame on me for not doing my research.

I would rather invest buku bucks in Ramirez than in Lee and Soriano, but only because I think the latter two would be horrible acquisitions. This year's free agent crop is underwhelming and I'm not sure we'll find anyone on the open market who warrants the cash they'll command. I'd be more comfortable being aggressive on the trade market, even if we give up pitching, or making smaller deals with overlooked FAs.

We could upgrade left field, for instance, by signing David Dellucci for $6-$7 million and platooning him with Thames.

[ewsieg]

I see no immediate need to replace Inge. If we could get Aramis, sweet, but I don't see anything else out there worthy of an upgrade. I'll lay all the blame at Inge for this game. But Ordonez, Polanco, and Pudge better be getting their share for the first 60 or so we lost.

[estrepe1]

Well, I was most definitely mistaken about his age. I thought I had read somewhere on this board that his OPS has 25 points in each of the last three, but I could be wrong about that, too.

Either way, shame on me for not doing my research.

I would rather invest buku bucks in Ramirez than in Lee and Soriano, but only because I think the latter two would be horrible acquisitions. This year's free agent crop is underwhelming and I'm not sure we'll find anyone on the open market who warrants the cash they'll command. I'd be more comfortable being aggressive on the trade market, even if we give up pitching, or making smaller deals with overlooked FAs.

We could upgrade left field, for instance, by signing David Dellucci for $6-$7 million and platooning him with Thames.

Ramirez the last three seasons:

.318/.373/.578
.302/.358/.568
.291/.352/.561

So his OBP is taking a significant hit but it seems that most of that is based on his BA going down. Same with his SLG...

His OBP has been consistently around 60 points above his BA and his ISO has been 260, 264, and 270.

Honestly I think if Ramirez is really available the Tigers should try to acquire him.

BTW Lee is a career .286/.340/.495 hitter.... that would be a significant upgrade from the .263/.310/.461 that Monroe produces.

Dellucci would be a good pickup as well.

[DrWho17]

Inge's error total tells us absolutely nothing about his defensive value, which is immense.
Errors are part of the calculation for fielding percentage. His fielding percentage tells us that on balls that he gets to, he makes a higher percentage of mistakes then most other third baseman. So errors do tell us something about his "defensive value".

[estrepe1]

Errors are part of the calculation for fielding percentage. His fielding percentage tells us that on balls that he gets to, he makes a higher percentage of mistakes then most other third baseman. So errors do tell us something about his "defensive value".

They tell something but not as much as people make out. If player A gets to more balls but makes more errors and player B has the range of Deivi Cruz but makes 0 errors who is the better defensive player?

[DrWho17]

What a horrible idea. Ramirez is 30 and has already slipped a bit, offensively and defensively. Investing $75 million in him because he had three good months in a potential walk year is absurd.

The Tigers will most likely be paying Ordonez long after he's lost his usefulness; there's no need to dole out another contract that is sure to have the same unhappy ending.
Just turned 28 this year. This would have been his third great year in a row.

2004 Chicago Cubs 145 547 99 174 32 1 36 103 316 49 62 0 2 .373 .578 .318
2005 Chicago Cubs 123 463 72 140 30 0 31 92 263 35 60 0 1 .358 .568 .302
2006 Chicago Cubs 157 594 93 173 38 4 38 119 333 50 63 2 1 .352 .561 .291

[DrWho17]

They tell something but not as much as people make out. If player A gets to more balls but makes more errors and player B has the range of Deivi Cruz but makes 0 errors who is the better defensive player?
It depends on whether the result of the error, is worse then not getting to the ball. Also, the definition of "getting to a ball" is arbitrary, and dependant on other factors, such as pitching and field. It's obvious Brandon Inge can out range Troy Glaus, but I'm not convinced Joe Crede/Mike Lowell/Eric Chavez wouldn't have a similar range factor, while making far fewer errors playing in Comerica park w/Detroit's pitching staff.

Eric Munson was slowfooted and not really a good fielder learning the 3rd base position, yet when he played third base for Detroit his range factor calculation was above league average, which really tells me range factor is a statistic that more team related then individual related.

[Oblong]

If we could get Ramirez would he have to play third?

The only thing I like about INge is his defense at that position.

[thewave84]

Inge is still relatively cheap, I wouldn't sign him to a multi-year deal, but a one-year deal is fine.

It may well have been his career year, but it is not horribly out of line with what he has done in the past, so he probably can approach these offensive numbers again.

I would think that his errors will go down slightly as he continues to build up experience at 3B and work on the finer points of playing there.

[estrepe1]

If we could get Ramirez would he have to play third?

The only thing I like about INge is his defense at that position.

I am pretty sure Ramirez is a good defender at third. I am not sure how good he would be anywhere else though.

It seems like a moot point right now... but supposedly Ramirez can opt out of his contract. I can see him doing that to get a big payday....

[berneree]

I think the ideal situation is Magglio being able to play 1B 80% of the time with adequate defense. Signing Aramis Ramirez to play 3B. Keeping Inge as a super-sub at C, 3B, and OF.

Finally....make a run at trading for Pat Burrell. That is the guy I really wanted Detroit to trade for at the deadline. 1 because he is a patient power hitter. 2 because it likely would have kept Abreu in Philly.

I think it will take more to get Burrell right now than it would have in late July.

[mikec444]

We have a team full of average to slighly above average hitters. Inge may hit 9th most games, but he's often the 6th, 7th or 8th best hitter in our lineup. Not good enough.

Inge (or Polanco/Infante/Monroe/etc.) needs to be our 9th best hitter next year. Doing the math, we need 2 or 3 better hitters to make that happen. Our lineup is flexible enough that we can pretty much take the best position players available. By "best" I mean: high OPS, young enough, not a decline on defense. By "available" I mean a free agent who'll come here for a fair price, or someone we can trade for at a reasonable price in talent returned.

Looking at the list of those people, from top to bottom, I think I see 15 or maybe 20 1B/OF types before I get to the 2nd best 3B. And even the best couple 3B (like ARam) would be candidates to move to LF or 1B, depending on who else we acquire.

I have no problem letting a 3B be our 8th or 9th hitter. 3B was not always a power hitter position. Pre-Mike Schmidt, 3B was as defensively focused as SS, look at how many 3B are in the HOF - not many.

Inge may not be Gold Glove worthy yet but he's a fine defensive player with flashes of brilliance. If we can craft a team with Pudge and 3B Inge hitting 8th and 9th, we'll be looking good.