Your Opinion: Surgery or Permanent Retirement?

[Just Some Dude]

In 2003 I started getting shoulder pains while throwing it didn't seem to serious then. Now after 3 years off I have been trying to get back into Pitching shape. When I throw on flat ground I still have shoulder discomfort, but I threw off a mound last week and it felt great. That same practice though I had the flat ground throwing pain but I had to test it on the mound :)

I always thought I had a rotator cuff problem but after searching the web more extensively I find I most likely have an SLAP tear. A specific type of labral tear is called a SLAP tear; this stands for Superior Labrum from Anterior to Posterior. The SLAP tear occurs at the point where the tendon of the biceps muscle inserts on the labrum. More Info (http://orthopedics.about.com/cs/generalshoulder/a/slap.htm)

I will be 30 in a couple months {gulp} I still feel very good except the shoulder issue. I really want to play again for my son (and myself). He is now 7 and doesn't remember the games he came to as a toddler. He lives with his mom and her boyfriend who is into football. So of course my son is into football at home. When he comes to my house he likes to play baseball with me.

I have already informed my coach that I am done, for this year at least. I really don't want to do further damage and jeopardize my ability to play catch with my boy.

So what do you guys think?

Should I just go on with life and retire? Or seek out a specialist to try and fix me up for next season?

[davidsb]

Tough spot, I hope everything works out for you. Any chance of thowing with the other arm? It might take a while to learn but it is an option while playing with you son. It never hurts to seek the opinion of an expert or two. Best of luck!

[Just Some Dude]

Tough spot, I hope everything works out for you. Any chance of thowing with the other arm? It might take a while to learn but it is an option while playing with you son. It never hurts to seek the opinion of an expert or two. Best of luck!

Yeah tough spot no doubt :(

I am sorta ambidextrous, I have thrown left handed before and it is so awkward. I don't think that is going to happen heh. I threw today and tried to use a few different arm slots. They all gave me shoulder discomfort. If I short arm the ball I feel no pain but I am sure my forearm or elbow will see problems. Not to mention I lose accuracy and I'm sure velocity.

I am still intrugued at the fact that throwing off the mound last week felt so good. I was throwing from a 3/4 arm slot, I use to be pretty much an over the top guy. I got more velocity and better command over the top. Ironically enough this injury is caused by over the top throwing motions.

I threw way to much as a kid, every day in the back yard, 100's of pitches a day. I thought I was going to be a big leaguer, and I trained like one. Built a mound, tied a net between 2 trees and threw every day till it got dark.

Wish I would of had a father around to tell me to stop it! Oh well life is good and bad for everyone.

[Billy Ringo]

Hang in there until you crash! Never give up, never, never give up!

[BiggieG]

Hang in there until you crash! Never give up, never, never give up!A Winston Churchill fan!?!?

[Corky]

A Winston Churchill fan!?!?

Sounds more like Commander Peter Quincy Taggart.

[DaYooperASBDT]

Have you tried underhanded yet? Worked for Danny Quisenberry, bless his soul ....

[zimm]

paging Dr. Microline....

my suggestion-throw submarine. it works for me, totally effs with guys my age when they try to hit it, and is a cool novelty for the kids...

it's very easy on the arm and there are a thousand variations on the motion that can avoid stress on the specific area that troubles you.

[zimm]

Have you tried underhanded yet? Worked for Danny Quisenberry, bless his soul ....

bastard-you beat me by mere second. btw-quiz is my hero :cry: [sheds a tear]

[DaYooperASBDT]

Trying to think of other guys that threw underhanded. There was a reliever with Cleveland back in the 80's (Thompson?) that did. I've heard that Eldon Auker dropped down quite a ways also. Chad Bradford and Mike Myers drop down as well.

[DaYooperASBDT]

Yeah Micro is the expert on this subject, no doubt. I've always heard that submarine was much less stressful on the shoulder, and that Quiz dropped down after such an injury .......

[zimm]

Trying to think of other guys that threw underhanded. There was a reliever with Cleveland back in the 80's (Thompson?) that did. I've heard that Eldon Auker dropped down quite a ways also. Chad Bradford and Mike Myers drop down as well.


Kent Tekulve was the most fampus non-Quiz submariner. he had some lame glasses...
http://www.autographedtoyou.com/celebpics/kent_telkulve3.jpg

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/features/1998/year/images/quisenberryphoto.jpg

[zimm]

Yeah Micro is the expert on this subject, no doubt. I've always heard that submarine was much less stressful on the shoulder, and that Quiz dropped down after such an injury .......


there is very little stress on the shoulder and elbow when you throw submarine. unless you're an *** like me who throws a submarine screwball...

it is kinda hard on the forearm, but managable. and muscular, not ligament/tendon...

[DaYooperASBDT]

Tekulve, YES, thank you! He was quite the sight, about 6'4" and maybe 160 pounds, with that boxy Pirate cap, dealing from down under. That's the first WS I remember watching (1979) .....

[tiger337]

I usually throw submarine when I pitch to my nephew. There is nothing seriously wrong with my shoulder but it bothers me if I throw too much. I can throw submarine all day and can throw just as fast underhand as overhand. I can't make the ball do anything but then I never could.

[DaYooperASBDT]

This thread reminded of my youth, and many sessions of pitching to the woodpile and trying out different breaking pitches. Dumb, because now my elbow gives me a lot of problems ......

[Just Some Dude]

Submarine style was one of the ones I tried today, and yeah I felt no pain but the ball also would of went behind left handed hitters lol.

I think next week I am going to find a specialist and schedule an appointment. Maybe there is something that can be done without surgery, maybe not. I just need to know my options I guess.

Thanks for the suggestions though. I have my son this weekend, maybe I will try to throw some wifle balls left handed and see if I can get comfortable. I always wished I was a left handed pitcher :)

[tiger337]

This thread reminded of my youth, and many sessions of pitching to the woodpile and trying out different breaking pitches. Dumb, because now my elbow gives me a lot of problems ......

I used to throw into an old tire. There was a big board that I leaned against a couple of trees and I hung the tire on the board. I'd go out there and 100 pitches a day - mostly fastballs at different arm angles. I used to fool around with a knuckle ball and split fingered pitch a little bit.

For fielding, I used to throw a tennis ball up against the house for grounders and up on the roof for flyballs. I ruined the side of the house. I think that worked because I did develop into a pretty good fielder. I was never much of a hitter though.

[Dusty]

Have you tried physical therapy? I had a similar injury (and like you, thought it was a rotator cuff), but after working out with a personal trainer ,who happened to be a chiropractor, and a PT in his office, I was able to throw harder and farther without any pain at all. This may not be the answer in your case, but it worked out great for me.

[DaYooperASBDT]

I recall hearing of certain instances when a pitcher simply had scar tissue in the shoulder, and with some manipulation of the joint, the doctor was able to tear the scar tissue loose. Just wild speculation of course, hope it's something minor like that!

[slim pickens]

Sounds more like Commander Peter Quincy Taggart.
Taggart from beverly hills cop?

[eastside billee]

What does this have to do with the Tigers? Is your real name
Wil Ledezma?

[Just Some Dude]

What does this have to do with the Tigers? Is your real name
Wil Ledezma?

Whatevah

[Billy Ringo]

If you have a "serious issue" you should see a doctor. To "open up" to a bunch of internet forum morons is likely to give you a couple of humorous or insensitive replies, and not much sound advice.

[DaYooperASBDT]

Technically, Billie is correct, this thread is OT, but JSD does have a baseball injury, so why not approach some knowledge-able people in a baseball forum? There are several ex-pitchers that post here.

JSD has stated that he's going to a doctor, so he was just seeking some peer advice. I would certainly qualify any advice that I give, as I'm more of an "Internet moron" than an expert. I can talk a good game on most any subject though !!

[zachcadillac]

If you have a "serious issue" you should see a doctor. To "open up" to a bunch of internet forum morons is likely to give you a couple of humorous or insensitive replies, and not much sound advice.

Seems like he's received quite a bit of good advice.

[Just Some Dude]

I said bad stuff, taking it back :)

[DaYooperASBDT]

While we are opening up, I'd like to get something off my chest. I feel that Corky is a blithering idiot.

[MichiganFan1717]

Good luck to you, whatever your choice. I don't know anything about pitching injuries like this, sorry I can't be of help.

[Billy Ringo]

On rereading your post, js dude, I see that you were probably more serious than some of us realized. I sympathize with your problem and I would have the surgery rather than give up baseball. I also sympathize greatly with you for the fact that your son is getting into football. That's a damn shame. Football is a game for the mentally inferior.

And, btw, I still don't think ES Billee was out of line, but then, he is a pal of mine and I am very often prejudiced in his favor.

[keystone]

If you have a tear it will not heal itself. Let a Doctor take a couple of Xrays and do some range of motion tests to tell you exactly what the problem is. I'm 20 years older than you, survived my own baseball career and my son's before throwing a ball to my dog finished me. By putting it off it will only add to the damage and add to your recovery time. I couldn't even pick up a bag of garbage without pain. Good Luck.

[Just Some Dude]

If you have a tear it will not heal itself. Let a Doctor take a couple of Xrays and do some range of motion tests to tell you exactly what the problem is. I'm 20 years older than you, survived my own baseball career and my son's before throwing a ball to my dog finished me. By putting it off it will only add to the damage and add to your recovery time. I couldn't even pick up a bag of garbage without pain. Good Luck.

I think I either have a tear or just lots of scar tissue. There is also liquid pockets that can form and other various things. If I need to have surgery I may opt out. Reading some of the recovery times and I realize I can't miss that much work. They say anywhere from 4-6 weeks of doing a bunch of nothing then rehabin for a few months. About 4-6 months for a full recovery. If my job was to sit behind the desk all day I'd be fine but I spend most my time picking up heavy monitors (75-100lbs) and workstations (25-50lbs).

Thanks for the post and the good luck :)

On rereading your post, js dude, I see that you were probably more serious than some of us realized. I sympathize with your problem and I would have the surgery rather than give up baseball. I also sympathize greatly with you for the fact that your son is getting into football. That's a damn shame. Football is a game for the mentally inferior.

And, btw, I still don't think ES Billee was out of line, but then, he is a pal of mine and I am very often prejudiced in his favor.

Yeah maybe this wasn't the right place for a serious post, I just didn't know where to go.

As far as my son being into football goes, I hate it! Last fall was his first year of tackle football, they made him a running back cuase he is fast but he is quite small. The offensive line on the team had no clue how to block and the QB or RB's always got creamed.

One kid on his team broke a leg and I told my son that is part of football. You are hard pressed to watch a football game and not see someone get hurt. He wants to play though, I'm stuck hoping he doesn't get hurt.

I never had an issue with Billee, just recently he has made 2 comments that have gotten to me a tad. This one more than the first but every one has their days. You seem like a nice enough guys and if he is a friend of yours he can't be so bad right?

Billee I apoligize for my part of this.

[keystone]

[QUOTE=Just Some Dude]I think I either have a tear or just lots of scar tissue. There is also liquid pockets that can form and other various things. If I need to have surgery I may opt out. Reading some of the recovery times and I realize I can't miss that much work. They say anywhere from 4-6 weeks of doing a bunch of nothing then rehabin for a few months. About 4-6 months for a full recovery. If my job was to sit behind the desk all day I'd be fine but I spend most my time picking up heavy monitors (75-100lbs) and workstations (25-50lbs).
QUOTE]

Dude,
Talk to a doctor before you make any decision so you know what you're up against. An examination can tell you what's wrong so that you can make an intelligent decision as to how to minimize future damage or how to repair it. Sounds like you're scared to get it checked out. Putting your head in the sand is not a good strategy. No one's going to come after you with a knife.

[Just Some Dude]

I am definetly getting it checked out, not scared at all. I am saying that if I need an SLAP repair surgery that I would be out of commision to long and jepordize my job.

I don't have AFLAC, so if I am hurt and miss work, I get nodda which is just as good as nothing :) I am currently going over worst possible senarios. I am hoping for good things but I have to also be willing to accept the bad.

[Just Some Dude]

I decided I would revisit this thread incase some where wondering what the verdict was.

I saw a specialist and had an MRI. Dr. told me eveything looks good and that I probably just had some inflamation.

I am playing this year and I have pitched in each of my teams 3 games so far this season. My pitching stats are updated in my signature. So far I am throwing well with no pain, and very little soreness the next day. I have yet to throw more than 2 innings though, just coming in to finish up games right now. I am building arm strength and stamina and will have my first start in the next couple weeks.

I am hoping to pitch atleast 5 innings in my first start but that will depend on how I feel. My goal is to be able to pitch the full 7 innings each outing.

Thanks again to those that had encouraging words for me, I really appreciate it.

[tater6]

I decided I would revisit this thread incase some where wondering what the verdict was.

I saw a specialist and had an MRI. Dr. told me eveything looks good and that I probably just had some inflamation.

I am playing this year and I have pitched in each of my teams 3 games so far this season. My pitching stats are updated in my signature. So far I am throwing well with no pain, and very little soreness the next day. I have yet to throw more than 2 innings though, just coming in to finish up games right now. I am building arm strength and stamina and will have my first start in the next couple weeks.

I am hoping to pitch atleast 5 innings in my first start but that will depend on how I feel. My goal is to be able to pitch the full 7 innings each outing.

Thanks again to those that had encouraging words for me, I really appreciate it.Excellent, glad to hear surgery wasn't needed.

[Just Some Dude]

Excellent, glad to hear surgery wasn't needed.

Thanks Tater, Im also very glad :) Feels so good to be pitching again.